Prospect
So, anyone have the word on Prospect? We’re kinda out of touch… I got nothing here – it all happened in Brooklyn.
CRCA
All hail Axis! In the end they were just too deep, too versatile, and too strong. If only they had a certain rider on their team, we could call them the Axis of Evil. We fought the Axis – how cool does that sound?
Laughing Ladies… sigh. I can’t be expected to come up with some pseudo-pithy line about you every week, you know. Look, even Schmalz is speechless.
Chris Mecray wins again, and we bask in his reflected glory by pointing out we called it. Mecray 1, anonymous hater 0. Mecray can now enjoy the lifestyle of the other famous individual who called his shot by downing dozens of hot dogs in a sitting.
We have one spot for the Whitmore’s CX race this weekend. Just put your name down below if you want it. Go support Myles! He puts on a good race. We might get another spot to give away later in the week.
Once again, keep it clean. The anonymous thing is to keep things fun and lively, and so you can sing the praises of others without embarassing yourself. Flames will be deleted.
@##=#<1,L>@##=#
I’ll take the CX spot! THANKS
That was quick. Done! Which day?
Nice fishtail pic Chris!
Yeah, really. Are you sure you should be riding on mud and grass if you can’t keep it straight on asphalt?
The rabbits got caugt (I was one of them).
Wet start to the race. 12 Kissenas lined up for the start. There were about 25-30 strong riders in the P123 chase field, which started 3 minutes later.
The Kissena group rode a paceline, but was whittled down to 7 by the halfway point, as guys dropped off after giving whatever they had. Then one of our guys got taken out by a rec rider on a mountain bike who went down on the downhill after being passed by the pace motorcycle. The six remaining guys were caught with 3 laps to go.
Sorry I don’t know who got the win.
Yea, no more racing on bald tires. I’ll take both days if you got ’em or just Sunday if I have to choose.
I’d love an entry to Sunday’s CX race.
The rabbits got caugt (I was one of them).
Wet start to the race. 12 Kissenas lined up for the start. There were about 25-30 strong riders in the P123 chase field, which started 3 minutes later.
The Kissena group rode a paceline, but was whittled down to 7 by the halfway point, as guys dropped off after giving whatever they had. Then one of our guys got taken out by a rec rider on a mountain bike who went down on the downhill after being passed by the pace motorcycle. The six remaining guys were caught with 3 laps to go.
Sorry I don’t know who got the win.
A Cup results?
1. Lisban Quintero (GS Mengoni)
2. David Osborne (Arthemis)
3. Anthony Taylor (Target Training)
4. Miguel Morras (Champion System)
5. Franklin Burgos (James Vincent)
6. David Sommerville (Champion System)
7. Glenroy Griffith (NYC Fire Dept)
8. Steve Ward (Colavita)
9. Ray Diaz (Target Training)
10. Daniel Zmolik (Cuevas)
also
14. Lenny Katz (Kissena) * Kissena Club Champion
Just Sunday, Chris. Patrick, if Myles gives us another spot I’ll let you know.
Jeff King is awesome.
Hefty — yes. Fast — maybe. Awesome — no.
Well, a touch of hyperbole maybe, but he’s clearly more awesome than you, pal, since I didnt see any other rider cross the line first…
His eating and drinking habits weren’t the best but he was a much better all around athlete than assumed now. In the off season after spending time watching the 6 day races at the Garden, he’d head off from his home on Riverside Drive and bike up 9W. He would regularly break 5 minutes TTing from the parking lot up to the police station on River Road. He held the time/kg record unitl it was broken last spring by the one and only Awesome Jeff King.
Who is the Babe? I thought you were going to make a comparison of King to the fat but talented baseballer, but sounds like you have a local cyclist in mind?
I think kyoo min did ranger hill repeats in the 4’s and mike mccarthy was even faster – of course that was with 19 lb bikes…
One of those guys went up Ranger Station SSSUPPERR DUUUPERR FAST on a group ride the year the CRCA championships was cancelled due to pavement problems and half the A field blasted up River Road in frustration
Hey Buddy-
King is NOT more awesomer than me. I should clarify though: Mildly Awesome — probably. Happy now, champ?
-Pal
What was the record time of Awesome Jeff King?
I heard he once led the BR charge up the hill at 20 mph.
How fast do you have to go to be in the 4’s?
Isn’t it about 1 3/4 miles?
Mike McCarthy was sponsored by Team Lotus in 1984. He once soloed in a 2 lap jr. race in the park and beat the field by almost 10 minutes.
There once was a girl from Nantucket…
Mike would have been about 12 in ’84. I do remember the pink lotus jerseys though. that was ’86 I think, Jimmy Keough and Gavin O’Grady on that team then. very foul-mouthed chatter in the pack. . . oh, and there’s no way in hell that McCarthy made the ranger station in the 4s. that one’s a real stretcher. that kid was a big strong side of beef, but a fairly mediocre climber. arrrgh. .. more wasted time. . .
Great pic of the Babe,Andy but could you find one of him at the 6 day cycling races? Back in the ’20’s, way before Spike Lee and celebrity row at basketball games, the 6 day cycling races were the big event at the Garden and the Babe was often in the front row downing hot dogs. Can’t vouch for him riding up 9W, and the Ranger Station probably wasn’t built yet.
It was a man, people. The person from Nantucket was a man.
The ranger station, and the River Rd drive as a whole, looks like its been there since well before the 1920s – dont forget the historic house at the bottom that dates to the Revolutionary War and Washington’s crossing. Of course the station likely wasnt a police station at the time, and Id be genuinely surprised if cyclists were out doing repeats back then on 30 lb creaky 1920s bikes, but it would be cool to know if that were the case for real.
Word is Will Riff does 4:45 from the bottom to the Ranger station, can anyone beat that, Smiliey? Xavier?
What’s the official measuring point for these times? Some people stop the clock at the "No passing" sign where the road first flattens out. Others take it a couple of hundred meters further to the parking lot. Others all the way to 9w.
Good point ADM – Im not sure the measurement is consistent – any consensus here? I assume its start of the road on bottom to the parking lot entrance on top (bottom lot entrance by the station, not top closer to 9W). Also, is it a standing start or rolling? – makes at least a few secs diff…
4:45 is WICKED fast, btw. Thats impressive. Esp given Will isnt that small a guy. Can the pros do much better than that? How about some CRCAers post some personal bests… Ive only done about 5:30, though havent really focused on TTing the hill as much as tempo and TH repeats…
There’s always a lot of talk about how fast you need to go up that hill in order to be competitive in whatever category, but aside from the GMSR prologue, how many races are there where you go up a hill just once? Not too many people get dropped on Tiorati the first time up, it’s the third and fourth laps that are the kicker. So I think your average time over 4-5 repeats is probably a better indication of where you stack up.
I was out on River Road on a rainy day a couple of winters ago and Mike Sherry was doing about his eighth hill repeat, and didn’t look to be going home any time soon. I doubt he was doing 4:45 times, but even if they were 6:45 it was still impressive. I wonder how many Hincapie used to do when he trained over there.
What are the commonly accepted start and finish lines for a River Road repeat? I’ve always gone from the stop sign in the parking lot to the entrance to the ranger station. See illustration above.
Wow – impressive graphics! Now thats NYVelocity service…
MH, I think you are clearly onto something here – No doubt overall fitness is better judged by the 8th repeat than the speed of the first. I think the TT discussion is simply fun chatter and a marker in the sand, rather than an effort to judge overall rider ability from speed of a 1 mi climb. Its kinda a sprint-like climb anyway, and Ive noticed a lot of riders who can comfortably climb River Rd at a decent speed but have a tougher time on a 2+ mi climb. You can "gut out" River Rd at above TH, but cant really do that easily when the distance gets 2x longer or more.
5:30 is pretty fast all the way to the parking lot rt turn.
I didn’t mean to put a damper on the bragging rights contest. I was just responding to the question about how fast a cat 4 should go. I think if you can do four repeats under 7:00 you’ll probably be competitive in most cat 4 races (if you’re aiming to win an uphill finish like Union Vale or the Fitchburg RR, maybe make it six and 6:00). That’s just a guess.
Speaking for myself, if I do five or six repeats in under 6:30 I feel like I’ve had a very good day training (I use the same markers as Schmalz). But I am not much of a climber. I think I did it in 5:30 once, trying to keep up with some faster guys.
All this talk of going uphill fast is making me queasy, does anyone time themselves going down that hill? Looks like I’ve got 2:30 coasting.
The pics are from my own private satellite, and can you please stop walking around the apartment nude.
Speaking as a 4, Ive found that the most competitive 4s today can do on the order of 5:30 or a bit faster (O’Malley has claimed 5:20, I believe, but he can confirm on his own…) for a single run, and then not be too pooped to do 5 more in under 6:30 min (though I would rather make the TT run the 2-3rd repeat to warm up). MH’s suggestion seems a bit light to be, honestly. My guess is likely not much slower than solid Cat 3 training times, but thats the nature of the Cat 4 races in the last couple years. Slower times and you can still hang easily in park races, but wont make the selection in the hard races.
A better authority on this topic might be A Wolfe or C Shaw or A Cohen, though, who both raced a lot more regional races this year than me. Those guys placed regularly, and I guarantee can do 6x 6 min without undue stress. They could do 7 min repeats all day long (think 15+).
Thats not to say you arent getting a perfectly solid workout though in anything under 6:30 for 6 repeats, as MH suggests.
Somebody please post a river road mileage, elevation gain, and profile!
All this talk about hill repeats has got me motivated….
1 min later….
that didn’t last long.
I only come to this page becuase I like the picture of the cat with the ice bag on his head. So cute.
I haven’t ridden Alpine in over a year, so I can’t comment. Chris M, what’s your definition of "undue?"
I think "undue stress" is revealed by apparent strain on the face akin to passing a gall stone, and I dont think a single digit number of repeats at 6:30 gets you there Aaron. 5x 6:30 with 5 min interval recovery is like a wee appetizer compared with the GMSR prologue that you dominated…
I really suck in the hills, just ask Molloy or Dr J. they drop me at will when we train. I did quite a few intervals up that hill two years ago., with a rolling start, starting my watch at the marina right when the road starts, stopping it at the second entrance to the parking lot I was hitting 5:30 to 6:30, but all I did that year is kill my finish.
Mike McCarthy was definitely not 12 in 1984. He was a year older than me and I was 15. He also used to change his front chainring after races to make the Jr. roll-out.
<<What are the commonly accepted start and finish lines for a River Road repeat? I’ve always gone from the stop sign in the parking lot to the entrance to the ranger station. See illustration above.>>
These are the start/finishes I’ve been using since you posted your "Power by the Numbers" section and defined them there. It does give you a nice round 1.25mi. On the other hand, it’s an unnatural place to sit up, as you’re still climbing a pretty good grade at that point. A lot of people keep going out to 9A, continuing to the highest point, somewhere around the radio tower/9-mile marker, about a 450ft gain. . . although there surely are distractions along the way, with two intersections (which might contribute to mental toughness, since dodging cars while suffering is a different flavor of pain).
Another question that arises as I read these impressive times is how they’re achieved: in the saddle or out? I can get much better times if I do the whole thing out of the saddle, but this probably has less training value than trying to get one’s best time in the saddle.
perhaps I’m wrong, but I distinctly remember him trashing me in a sprint in Prospect Park in summber of ’86. I looked over to what seemed to be a giant sixth grader flying by. On the roll-down I asked him how old he was and I remember him saying 14. . . maybe it was ’84. BTW, bikes were heavier than 19lbs then. . . more like 21-22lbs for average Columbus SL/Reynolds 51 frame.
So it was either ’84 or ’86 and he was somewhere between 12 and 18, depending on the actual year… what is "distinctly remembered" again?
Oh, for crissakes, stop bein’ an ol’ lady. . . but you’re right, my "distinct" memory" was ’84: I just found this interesting little tidbit confirming the great rider’s true age:
*1996 Olympic Trials Men’s Individual Pursuit Final. Mike McCarthy vs Kent Bostick. McCarthy was 27 years old . He raced for and had been supported by the US National Team and had their pricey state-of-the-art "Superbike" – a clear favorite. Bostick was approaching 43, racing for Team Shaklee, not the highest budget team – a clear underdog if there ever was one. The enviable job of cameraman Scott Ogle and me was to supplement the actual race coverage by shooting the coaches giving the racers splits, getting the reactions, etc. We spent most of the time on McCarthy’s side, with US National Team coach Craig Griffin, since McC was the prohibitive favorite… but as time went on and Scott and I looked up at the split times on the scoreboard we had the sense we were in for a big upset. At one point we looked at the scoreboard, looked at each other, and tore across the infield as fast as we could to the other side. Bostick’s coach, Mark Whitehead, was going absolutely nuts yelling splits to Kent… As you probably know, Bostick pulled the huge upset and was as excited as a kid in a candy store about finally qualifying for the Olympics after all his years of trying!! It was an electric moment for me and Scott, and was actually one of the most exciting sports moments I’ve ever experienced.
kwk wat finsih?
The usual River Road repeat (for me):
Starting from the gate house at the bottom (there’s a change of pavement), ending at the "No Passing" sign.
My best is 4:42 (though I usually do it between 4:50 and 5:30, depending on the time of year). Dave Somerville did a little better than that, perhaps 4:38. Jason Bremer did around 4:30. I heard that Todd Heriott does it near 4:10.
For bragging rights only. Pick a Saturday. All we need is two watches and two cell phones.
Winner gets a 6 pack and all the dogs you can eat at Papaya King.
Yikes! That sounds fast Eugene – Im hoping the sign you refer to is before the turn-in to the pkg lot, but it would have to be somewhere well down the hill before the last corner for me to make those types of times. Oh well, I guess its something to strive for in my next life.
get a life. you are our new lee3, only gay.
To "get a life": Nice post. Very clever. Way to go.
We like Chris because he doesn’t bullsh!t. Did he beat you in last week’s sprint?
yes, he beat me, but he didn’t beat you.
OK, so I did say "yikes" in my last post – it does sound sorta gay in retrospect. And Im wearing purple/yellow riding socks that I won in Hungry’s mini-competition. And I sort of like opera. Hey, maybe I am gay! Never considered it, but I guess its possible…
no, he didn’t beat me (and who’s going to make THAT joke first, i wonder?) because i’m a lowly 5. but he would’ve.
chris, i like opera, too. or some, anyway. la traviata in the park a few weeks ago with two wottles of bine–one of my better showings in CP. i stumbled home.
you gotta add at least 15-20 seconds from no passing sign to the rt hand turn to the parking lot.
By the way i’ll bet every cent I have O’malley can’t do 5:20 to the turn off.
someone ought to organize a time trial on the hill, settle this once and for all
Yeah, someone should organize it. Someone should run a series up there actually. It’d be great. Someone should do it.
Someone never does shit. Someone should do something about it.
Someone’s full name is Someone Else.
Self timing race. Post results in next week’s hangover.
The winner gets to be called a liar and a cheat.
There could possibly be an unofficial TT on Rvr. I’m not certain of the logistics but I guessing it could be done with maybe three guys, that software Westwood Velo used @ Silvermine, and two really good radio walkies. One guy would count off the start @ the base the other would call out the finish @ the top and the third guy would track the results on a laptop.
Yeah, those three guys should really do that. They are lazy though.
Well at least we’ve narrowed it down to those three guys from someone. Now we’re getting somewhere!
To tell everyone to run for it because the Rangers are going to bust you.
i think those 3 guys should run a river rd TT. i like seeing lee 3 tricked out on his tt bike.
BTW… to anonym., i think O’malley would take that bet and probably clean you out. Have you seen his results lately?
I’ve got One Guy’s and Third Guys email addresses if you need them – contact me offline and I’ll give them to you so you can tell him how to do it. I don’t have the Other Guy’s addy, but maybe One Guy or Third Guy does.
Maybe Lee3 can get Lee1 and Lee2 to help.
Yea…. that 4th guy might just be the case. five ‘o’ are real pricks over there.
lee1 is pushin up daises and lee2 lives in Mich.
Bustin’ on dead people! That’s what I’m talkin’ about!
He can’t do 5:20.
This hangover is so old, I’m drunk again
and if he can’t do it, Other Guy should
We want our hopeful Friday!!!
Anybody going to Hampton’s CX?
What time does it start?
Check the homepage geniuses. Do we have to hold your hands?
It was the blonde. Totally lost my concentration.
What team is she on?
This guy won the ranger station hill climb last year
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6184680728064832823&q=Audi+R8&hl=en
Hey, I did mention 4:45 to someone, but if you are going by the 1.07mi. distance, I have done that in 4:20.
Will