Section head text.
No NYC races to speak of, so it’s time to invade the hinterlands. Well, Massachusetts and New Jersey at least.
I will be at Jiminy doing my one out of region race, feel free to come by and taunt me about my missing wheel. I still hold onto hope that I will have a surprise reunion with my missing wheel at Jiminy Peak, and I will scoop up my wheel into my arms and spin rapidly in delirious delight while being filmed in slow motion – this is going to take a lot of equipment, so please let me know if you’re bringing the wheel beforehand, so we can set up the shot.
is at the coffee shop in piermont. best. muffin. evar.
Runcible muffins on steroids?
I like it when people get hot and bothered about upgrades
Good point. The service at Runcible is terrible and so slow. There has to be a better place in Nyack.
with the crowds at Runcible. Any suggestions of good bakery stuff near there?
What/where is Bunbury?
"OMG… Are you guys going to post about yourselves again?"
I lost today’s race– when I arrived, they were out of raisin scones at the Bunbury.
No scones? WTF! (???!!!!?!?!?!?!) FUBUNBURY!
OMG… Are you guys going to post about yourselves again?
They actually won Palmer last week in the Pro 1 2.
Northeastern Hardware placed top-4 overall at the High Point Uphill Time Trial… Who are these guys???
Northeastern Hardware placed top-4 overall at the High Point Uphill Time Trial… Who are these guys???
…we’re triply impressed.
Northeastern Hardware has been a very good regional-level team from Jersey for years. At least ten years.
Mike Rosenhaus from the team has won some big stuff over the years, and Dave Martin and some other guys are really strong.
if there are any pictures from Jiminy on the web
Northeastern Hardware placed top-4 overall at the High Point Uphill Time Trial… Who are these guys???
Great work to JP (2nd in the 3s) and Jon Warchol of CCC (3rd in the 4s) also to Jodan C (6th in the 4s).
http://www.berkshirecycling.org/races/jiminy_results.php
Are people really coming home from the bars at 5am? That seems really late. What time do bars close? I didn’t thinnk they were open 24 hours a day.
bars do stay open past 4am they just pull down the shutters. also there are after hours place, apartments and drugs to keep the party going. and then they’re clubs open until noon.
a lot of clubs stop serving at 4 but stay open until 5 or later (or is that earlier?).
Empire was very impressive too. John L 5th DANIEL Z 4th, Lisban 10th.
And Nice result JP K! 2nd in the 3s
to get results with a hangover.
If you haven’t gone to sleep yet.
I always knew there was something I liked about Ugli…
Before club races, I (old guy) stop in Dunkin Donuts for a bagel and coffee. Young revelers are there too, only it’s the last stop after a long night. Changing of the guard.
About a month ago my next door neighbor had a big birthday bash. I went home early because to get a few hours of sleep before one of the first Spring Series races.
at 5:30, I shared an elevator with some of the stragglers from the party…
yeah, i go to school in the city, planned on being a racer, and that has deteriorated — to much other stuff to distract you.
i think it’s catching on a bit more. there are a bunch of young guys on the aforementioned teams and a few on nyvelocity, but i think you’re right–the lifestyle doesn’t suit the current youth. too much too give up. more power to those few youngsters who do it!
Collegiate cycling has been getting bigger and bigger every year so younger racers are getting into the sport. However, my guess is that most of the collegiate cyclists’ families don’t live in NYC so they wouldn’t be racing here. It is hard to imagine taking up cycling while growing up in the city. The few that do more often than not seem to have some kind of family connection of the sport.
the partying is totally one answer. i used to come home at 5am and see idiots heading to CP for a race and thought "what dumbasses"
also, if you’re a racer, and are thinking about going to college, nyc won’t be top on your list.
Ny riders are old because NYC is where you go when it’s time to get a job. Except NYC has such a strong bike racing tradition that you can do both. The fact that old dudes can be so competitive while also being successful professionals is inspiring. The real question is what’s wrong with the rest of the young guns that they couldn’t beat the old guys?
People spend a lot of time on this site comparing and contrasting different riders and different locales and different this/that. Whatever. Bike racing is fun. Move on if you want to. Don’t if you don’t.
"I think it is that NY costs so much that young guys are working, not riding."
and partying. I know I was. tough to have the discipline to get up early to train and race in NYC when you’re young and single
To the couple of anonymous posts yes I was aware of the 10 top 10 places etc and have read the fine print. Unfortunately I have not been racing that long here in the US so do not qualify as I was told that my cat 4s races in the UK did not count (even though the races tend to be longer and yes have full fields). I have twice applied for upgrade the latest on Tuesday evening hoping to ride JP 3 and have been rejected twice.
To K King, you are right that would be an alternative and I am sure I will do a few of those. I guess with 3 active kids you have to be a little selective about what races you do…to spend all day driving to JP racing and coming back…is a lot to ask. As I eventually want to ride with the team I would limit those days to races where points are on the table if you have a good ride. Same reason I cannot be bothered to drive to New Jersey for a short road race. Just involves too much time (for no potential points) on a weekend where kids are just as active!
Glad this stirred up some activity!
the three guys in the top 10: 2 of them are 30+ and the other is 25+.
I think it is that NY costs so much that young guys are working, not riding.
Water bottles tossing in the 4s was funny. 🙂
had three guys in top ten
as it is that we need to get more young guys in the NYC area racing. Sakonnet U25, CRCA Junior Dev (and a little Mengoni, at least last year with Salon) are doing that.
Look at the ages of the top 3 guys in the 1/2/3 race. 25,24 and 22.
Most of the 25+ guys in the top 10 are CRCA / NYC. The other 123 riders are in their young 20s. Is this a good thing? Are NYC riders sticking with it in their old age or do we need to get a life and move on?
I’m not judging, I am old too but wow… nyc riders are old.
We saw the aftermath…Glad no one was hurt. One of the local fireman, with his dog on his pu track was def a part-timer looked like he just crawled out of a bar…I almost ran over another fireman as we rubber-necked the scene. Opps…Yes, putting things in perspective.
http://www.berkshirecycling.org/races/jiminy_results.php
I think someone from Empire was 4th in the p-1-2 and someone from Bicycling was 9th.
Mark Alden of Blue Ribbon was second in the 35+. Roger Aspholm was alway a long time and then David Taylor and George Suter more briefly.
In the 45+ Doug O’Neill was 4th.
Marc writes "I am sitting out this weekend because the JP Cat 4 closed weeks ago and the New Jersey race does not qualify for points. All I want to do is be able to race and have some fun but it seems that is not possible-it seems unless oyu are at least a 3."
Why can’t you have fun in the NJ race in the 4s? Just do the race. If there’s a race that’ll help you upgrade, then pick that one over something else, but if not, just race for fun.
marc,
It seems you are over 35 yrs of age from your post below. Just do Masters 35+, you’ll be racing with some Cat 1 and 2 riders in the bigger Northeast races. Granted results in these races won’t officially count for upgrade points but if its a higher level of competition you want (than a 4 race) then just ride with the Masters. They also might give you the benefit of the doubt when looking at your overall result resume when you try and upgrade to a 3 if you do place in some Masters events.
I’m just so freaked out and this gives some perspective on things
On the way home on the Taconic about 15 miles north of Poughkeepsie, the car in front of me (a couple hundred yards ahead) suddenly veered right and either hit the barrier or jerked away, then went into the left barrier hard. The front of the car was totalled, both driver and pasenger airbags deployed and luckily the two people in it were unhurt, but one was almost hysterical. Really scary to see.
Two or three other cars stopped too and we got the situation under some control until help arrived — sight lines were good so it wasn’t too scary having traffic come by. Unfortunately the flares in my car (which I got around the time we got our previous car) didn’t work — need to replace those. I’m still kind of freaked out from seeing the crach and one of the women in the car bawling so hard.
Ack.
If you don’t want anything to be left to discretion just use the 10 top 10 finishes or 25 pack finishes!! Its that easy people. Even the worst rider on the worst team ius capable of this. If you feel you should be a "3" then you can easily do one of those 2 things. IS that clear???? There is no uncertainty at all. USA cycling does’t need to clarify their rules because people are too lazy to read the fine print…
there aren’t any hills long enough around here to even KNOW who the ‘pure climbers’ are. ie. fast times up RR don’t = pure anything.
I would call a guy who could ride 5:30 on river road about 30 seconds too slow to even warrant discussion about "pure" climbers.
Anybody know what happened?
If you are a 4 and have been one for more than a year or so and are getting top 10 results with some regularity it would be cool if you’d submit an upgrade request and clear out the field a bit so Fall Bear takes at least 30 minutes to fill. As previously noted, there seems to be some amount of discretion in the process so you’d think at least some people will get moved up. (My own theory is that demonstrated experience is a bigger factor than demonstrated results but I’m totally unburdened by any facts)
If your request gets rejected you will be inoculated against any and all sandbagging accusations.
Sorry hear should be here – half asleep this morning – no need to drive to Jiminy when I can sleep. Again – priority – sleep.
And people see cycling different – you might feel ok with riding as a 3,4 or even 2. The fact is you still have to take time out of your day – 2hours at least to train then you race weekends which also takes time away from family etc.
Everyone hear can say that I have my priorities straight. If you don’t think so, ask around. My family comes first, work second and cycling third. And even with a sick and dying child – I was there for him and the guys I ride with. Maybe you can call the team I manage a 2nd family. And it is not just them. Also other riders too – you can ask the guya at Anthem or Mengoni this. Or for that fact any local team.
Your argument about we should do more important things with their riding – and that runners and maybe even cycling specific clubs hate us – well maybe they hate you? Our team donates money to charity every years – and not a little bit – and we do this as a team. My team is mandated to do at least 1 charity ride a year- so far I have averaged like 3 to 4 in the last few years. We also host events where we can raise money for charities and foundations – like the event I am hosting and running on May 14th. – That money is going to the son where my son spent his last few weeks of his life just a couple of weeks ago. And this was planned long before I knew he would die.
So if people want to upgrade – it is their choice and as a matter of fact right too provided if the rules are clear enough for upgrading. If they can upgrade and ride well with less than 14 hours of trainging – like Kevin Molloy or John Lohner to name new proclaimed local guys – then fantastic. The rules though aren’t clear which is why i started this debate. And with Gabe Lloyds post the other day, I was like – ok something isn’t clear about the upgrades as there is to much room for interpetation – maybe because the word "discretion" is listed on there.
Those of you who know me can attest that I am not the bragging kind at all – love competitive cycling – as a hobby – still suck – and admire and typically wish good will to all the guys I race/ride with.
Ray
are you aware of the "pack finishes clauses to upgrade from 4 to 3? From USA Cycling site: "or experience in 25 qualifying races with a minimum of 10 top ten finishes, or 20 pack finishes with fields over 50. 30 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade" – if you really want to upgrade you can. I know guys who have never even finished a race with hills w/ pack and are now 3’s – its all about your priority.
Ok, I used to think this was stupid not true but Marc to have 3 points after those results is crazy. And with a win, just doesn’t make sense. He sbould have like 20+ points.
But I also heard it is possible to upgrade to 3 with race experience. I think they let some upgrade with like 20 race finishes or something like that.
Speak for yourself. I am neither unemployed nor in my 20s nor in my 30s, am married and have 3 kids. I am sitting out this weekend because the JP Cat 4 closed weeks ago and the New Jersey race does not qualify for points. All I want to do is be able to race and have some fun but it seems that is not possible-it seems unless oyu are at least a 3. When Bear 4 race closes in 10 minutes and the 3s were still open a few days ago something has to be wrong with how things are being run in this sport. Reality is despite a 5th at BR, a win at last Sunday’s 3/4 Spring Series and 2nd at Floyd Bennett I was informed that I had a grand total of 3 points for my upgrade (one of the points not even being earned from the above). So get off your soap box and figure out that some of us see upgrading as an achievement in itself and would rather compete and fail at a higher level than place at lower one.
who gives a sh*t about upgrading. Unless you’re in your 20’s with mad time on your hands or you’re unemployed, the rest of us have to make do with maybe 10 hours (14 if we’re lucky)..so we’re stuck at cat 4. If you ask me..guys looking to upgrade to 3’s or 2’s are 1)young guns or 2)Old farts thinking they’re gonna be Lance, and forgot they have a family and priorities. For the rest of us, it’s all about having fun, and competing against others with similiar abilities. So if you’re still a Cat 4 well then so be it, as long as you’re having fun. No one is really gonna give a sh*t if you’re a Cat 1,2,3 or whatever. Who you going to brag to? You’re coworkers? They don’t give a sh*t. Your teamates? Get your head out of your a*s and start thinking straight. Now when you sign onto a Pro team..then that’s big shit. You win a sprint in Central Park you win braggin rights for the weekend. Here today, gone tomorrow. Do you think anyone is going to give a sh*t 2 weeks from now after you’ve won a race?
But all this talk about who is going to win what for local braggin rights is just plain silly. Get a life. If you want to do some good, then ride for a particular cause. No wonder NYRRC hates us, cuz we’re just a bunch of dudes in tights, pulling our d*cks out at 6am, terroizing joggers and tourists with our high tech mobile skewering devices, and not really donating anything back to the community.
i’m purely gonna win jiminy
because americans are pussies
I’d call him ‘generous’.
Apparently, this year I’m a "pure eater"
I’m a "pure drunk".
I’d call him ‘generous’.
Looking at the races on BikeReg, NJbikeracing.com, Racelistings – looks like most of the races in the area – dont even meet the requirements – that is CRAZY. Promoters should put on races that meet upgrade requirements – or the USCF should consider re-thinking their rules.
Also, how is that in most other countries – when you get a license – there isn’t a category structure – (all but Canada, England and Australia) it is 1 category ELITE. Why is it so different here?
Please go away.
"LOL"
Q: what would you call a guy who can ride 5:30 on river road but never won a sprint finish in any category?
A: A bad cyclist
Cat 5 guy trying to learn and asking questions. Yes.
And this is a good description of the course: "t’s harder than palmer, but not as nervous (except at the end). if you’re in the top 20 riders into the last corner and can go uphill fast, you’ll do well."
About five or six years ago I was on a team with a rider who was very fast in the sprints, and could also climb and ride breaks pretty well too. Pretty thin guy. So this slightly fat who can go quick at the end of easy races kept telling us we should pick him up for our team to be our sprinter. We politely told him that X was our sprinter and this guy says "No, I mean a PURE sprinter." LOL.
Road upgrades: http://www.usacycling.org/news/user/story.php?id=580
Track upgrades: http://www.usacycling.org/news/user/story.php?id=2626
if the race is too easy you should make it harder. see steve goldman as example of how to do this and how to ride agressively. if you can’t you’re only strong enough for a top ten anyway.
Yes. I think it is only at much higher levels that designations like "pure climber" actually mean something. If the entire field is good shape, then the differences become meaningful. Most local races do not have strong enough fields for all of this to matter. That’s not to say that the racing isn’t good, but generally, those who are fitter will win.
A good cat 1/2 "all rounder" would, in my mind, crush a cat 3/4 "pure climber" on a sustained climb.
If you outlaw TTs, only the outlaws will have TTs.
It’s more important to be pure than it is to be a pure climber. Grazie – ciao.
This way all the riders know. Also, would it be possible for the USCF – when granting permits to promoters, that the promoters host races that qualify. I mean – a race is a race to me no matter the distance – I mean, if you are a 1 on the track – that doesn’t mean you and kilo well. Shouldn’t all races count – it would be great to know why shorter races – that might fall a mile or so under the rules wouldn’t qualify. These shorter races are hard too – maybe for the guys that are used to endurance and hills.
Ray
but this topic doesn’t really suit my abilities.
And to be honest, at this level, how well you climb is more about what kind of shape you are in. All of these other labels are just plain silly for more guys in the area.
"And to be honest, at this level, how well you climb is more about what kind of shape you are in. All of these other labels are just plain silly for more guys in the area."
Okay. this I agree with. but i’d apply it to all aspects of cycling: sprinting, climbing, riding the flats, etc. No?
Look, if you can go up river road in 5:30, there is no excuse not to be in the running to win a lumpy 3/4 race. It’s all about reading the race.
Guys who huff and puff up Harlem Hill say things like "This is so true. crap riders say things like "I’m a climber so I don’t need to do well in races because they are not hilly enough" Then when the race is hilly,. they just need to come up with another excuse. it is always "the race wasn’t hard enough""
kaminski to win the 3s.
what would you call a guy who can ride 5:30 on river road but never won a sprint finish in any category?
monkeys are pure climbers
are monkeys amateurs too?
Lay off the monkeys.
alpine is good shape
my friend did it in 5:12 yestarday
no joke
he’s a pure climber.
"there’s no such thing as an amateur ‘pure climber.’ that’s just an excuse bad riders use to explain why they can’t win races."
This is so true. crap riders say things like "I’m a climber so I don’t need to do well in races because they are not hilly enough" Then when the race is hilly,. they just need to come up with another excuse. it is always "the race wasn’t hard enough"
Most of the good sprinters in the club would destroy the "pure climbers" on a hill.
Is a good course for anyone who is good.
there’s no such thing as an amateur ‘pure climber.’ that’s just an excuse bad riders use to explain why they can’t win races.
kaminski to win the 3s.
Thank you very much for all your comments everyone! I appreciate it a lot.
This would be a good course for Lance Armstrong, Paolo Bettini, Alejandro Valverde or Tom Boonen. Eddy Merckx probably would have also done well on this course.
jiminy could best be described as sort of a "central park on steroids." … aw!
Fucked.
Fucked.
try to drill the hill and get something going, but it’s going to be hard unless you split along with a good group (of people who are not pure climbers!) who are ready to hammer the longish descent.
"so you have to ride at the front, but not in the wind, be a good climber and sprinter, and stay off the shoulder. done. i’m winning."
in other words….the more racing experience you have the better off you are. if you are a cat 5 these are useful things to think about, since you probably have limited racing experience, no?
what would people recommend if you’re a ‘pure climber’?
it’s harder than palmer, but not as nervous (except at the end). if you’re in the top 20 riders into the last corner and can go uphill fast, you’ll do well. good luck!
so you have to ride at the front, but not in the wind, be a good climber and sprinter, and stay off the shoulder. done. i’m winning.
Thanks! Would you liken it to Palmer, it sounds like?
but i have never raced palmer. someone else? also, watch out for the road surface….especially at the shoulder. stay at the front as much as you can, but out of the wind.
the course follows a big loop, and the most significant factors are the one "big" hill (to the finish) and the wind. stay out of the wind. the finish favors a sprinter/climber combo– very big sprinters might struggle with the climb, but it is a real sprint at the end so the skinny-skinniest climbers rarely win. you need to be very far forward before the descent leading to the final climb…..there is a RH turn (wide) and then a climb, with one step, to the finish. be at the front and look for someone who is going hard early and grab their wheel. they will pull you as far as they can and if you’re lucky you will be in position to put it all out for the finish.
look at this stretch when you cover it during the race. good luck!
are so hot right now
I’m racing it this weekend. I’m pretty green to racing to be honest (one of those dreaded "cat 5’s"!). I’m just wondering what the course is like? I’m not experienced enough to be able to judge from the little ride profile on their site. What kind of rider does well there? Do breaks ever succeed (ok, granted, the answer in 4/5 races is almost invariably no, but still!)? What to look out for?
No cat 5 hate on this pls. thx
are there gonna be enough 3’s out there so i can get upgrade points?
Err…the VeloCity races start at 11:30am, with registration open at 10.
Re: VeloCity
The races start at noon. These are NOT USCF races so no license is required. I don’t know exactly what all the prizes are (I’m not organizing this, just spreading the word) but the prize for 1st place working messenger is roundtrip airfare to Dublin for the messenger world championships.
I know that there are some Chrome bags for prizes, and you can expect stuff from the other sponsors (Manhattan Portage, Kryptonite, Crankbros, etc.) as prizes/give aways.
Last years VeloCity tour was free, and you got a toolbag, multi-tool, speed-lever, hats, shirts, etc. just for showing up!
What time does it start? Is this a USCF race? What are the prizes? What is the entry? Do I need a license? I went to the website and nothing could be found. Then again, I’m dumb. Thanks.
Good luck to all traveling up to Jiminy and especially the boys from DC Racing and CCC.
Good luck Gabe. Mihael, way to put the pressure on your rider.
The VeloCity tour is at Kissena on Sunday at noon. Track racing and better prizes than any road race you’ve ever been to. Plus I’m pretty sure it’s free!
http://cyclehawk.com/velocity/
When key memories of races revolve around dinner afterwards….
Description of schmalz bust was funniest thing ever on nyvelocity.
Mihael
Ginger. Also, woof.
Got a table no problem one Saturday early (like 5:30 or 6pm) for dinner a few years ago.
Will try Cafe Latino at some point.
Mehi, you can have a sticker just for asking. If Gabe wins you can hump my cat, or Ginger will hump you, or, daisy chain.
My team mate Gabe will win the 3 race at Jiminy. He really wants the points…..and a mug.
Mihael
ps; do I get a dog fucking a cat sticker if I’m right?
always appropriate
WILLIAMSTOWN, May 5 — A New Jersey man was arrested today for indecent exposure after entering an undergraduate dining hall wearing a costume that bystanders described as "obscene." He was apprehended after stuffing a dinner roll in his mouth and asking students if they had "seen his zip."
I’m looking more for a "wearing sandals and a mankini" type place…
rufus looked good last weekend. he’s my pick for the 3’s. CCC also has a full squad in the 3’s so they may be active.
dinos in the 35+
http://bedrock.deadsquid.com/img/characters/dino/dino.gif
If you’re staying up there, the nicest place to eat is Mezze, on Water Street in Williamstown. You might need a reservation. The same people also have a Brazilian restaurant in North Adams called Cafe Latino that’s good.
Word has it the Triple Nickle has closed! Where is the best place to eat after the race now?
Guess you’ll just have to Zipp right over to the golden arches.
Who will do well there is Empire going in Force? Alder for the 3s? Will Riff?
Empire has full lineup
There was someone besides Luke taking pictures at the track on Wednesday… does anyone know who that was? Maybe they can send the photos to NYVC. There was someone filming too!
I’ll be in Mass this weekend officiating at Jiminy and doing results for the crit in Williamstown the next day. Come say hi if you see me.
Looking forward to next Sunday 🙂
Alan