At Ephrata, we have results for 2 of the 3 stages. In the Jackson Road Race, category 123 was won by Bobby Lea, with Empire’s John Loehner 4th and Bissell’s Joao Correia 6th. “Dancing” Dan Zmolik making a comeback from his cracked bone by finishing 11th. In the 3/4 race, Filip Capala takes a great win.
In the Pain Mountain Time Trial, the “results” page completely fooled me into posting incorrect results – never post results before your second cup of coffee. Westwood’s Will O’Donnell won the TT in the 3/4. But I will go ahead and mention my favorite name pun again for Mr. Prinsloo again anyway – Royal Potty, there I said it; and now I can get on with my day.
Ephrata Crit results are pending.
Complete results are here.
At Kissena, the weekend brought about a multitude of races and results. In the 1/2/3 Omnium, Karl Roesler of Affinity beat his Madison partner Andrew LaCorte of Planet X for the overall. In the 4 field, the unattached Marius Farioletti wins the Omnium. In the women’s field, Stacey Jensen of Kissena wins the omnium.
The epic poem of results in PDF form is here.Â
Photos by Harry Zaverdas are here.Â
In the Spring Series, Igor Misicki and Scot Wisenbaker of Foundation got away (really far away) on the 1/2/3 race, and finished with about 4 and a half minutes on the field. Igor claimed the series overall title. Eric Robertson of Kissena won the field sprint for the 3/4 race. Global Locate went 1-2-3 in the Masters’ race, with Gary Steinberg, Juan Pimental and Jerry Martinez making the podium. Steinberg claimed the overall Masters’ series win. George Gyarmathy finished a distant last place from Spain, but still won the overall title in the 3/4 category.
There’s no information about results from the Tour of Belleville, if you happened to win that race, please drop us a comment below.
Sturbridge and Palmer races have only stone silent PDF race announcements as computer evidence of their existence, so if you were successful at either of those races, feel free to also stroke your ego below.
More Kissena photos from Patrick Littlefield are here.
The TT “results” Are Start times- DR. Will won the 3/4 TT, Filip won RR and Crit and overall- great work
Oh, and FIRST!!!!!!
This internet is hard to cipher!
The track rocked this weekend. It’s going to be a very good year at the velodrome, I have this funny feeling….
Twilight series starts on Wednesday; Masters, Women, and Juniors start next Monday the 5th. Come out to race or watch; should be a hoot.
http://www.kissena.info/track
Wow great weekend for the youngster. He needs to get on a team and start learning from the older Cat1s and 2s. Nice Job.
thru the grapevine, there was a very serious accident on 9W descent into Rockland, 40+ mph, as a car pulled a classic pass and right turn over a cyclist. He is in stable but serious condition at Nyack Hospital.
Please be aware and take care out there.
is known as alex and he is also an affinity rider
seems that the stronger Shrek did the attacking (La Redoute, and prior to final climb) and the “older” bro did diddly! Shoulda reversed the pecking order…just got off the phone with Barney Rice, and he agreed…
http://www.bikereg.com/Results/2008/04/26-Sturbridge.asp
What’s going on? Fields seemed small this weekend at Palmer/Sturbridge in 1/2 (men and women). Jiminy 1/2 has 51 guys preregistered as of right now.
Bob German, Ron Larose of CCNS (both won) Eric Merrill of Keltic, Reed A of Adler and Ernest Taukust of Exodus all in the top 5 both days. These guys are flying.
http://www.bikereg.com/Results/2008/04/27-Palmer.asp
Yes – Sterling 3/4 has like 10 guys and its 2 weeks away, JIminy Cat 3 has 70 or so and the registration closes Wed. No day of registration either. Racing seems down for the Regional races. All these guys that bought there Pinarello Princes with Lighweight wheels have moved on to the next sport. BTW – since when is it the norm to only do Gimbels as your weekend racing and the majority of these riders roll out on 13k Pinarellos, Colnagos etc. Makes me sick!
You need some other stuff to be sick about, Billy Bragg.
I thought I would give you guys my view of the Palmer Library Road Race:
It was 45 degrees and drizzling at the start. No warm up. Just sitting in the truck trying
to decide what to wear. We were off without much fanfare and I tucked in to the front middle
of the pack for what I hoped would be an easy 60 mile ride. My expectations going into the race were
for several mundane crashes over the 3 circuits, a long hard run-in from the bridge to the finishing climb,
a finishing straight crash, and a debris filled up-hill sprint to cap things off. And that’s exactly what the race delivered.
But, having said all that, there were some heroics prior to the finish line. I was sitting in doing absolutely no work
and I wasn’t changing my tactic for anything. A break-away of 4 riders went up the road during the first lap
and over the course of the next lap or so had put 1:20 into the field. At the start of the last lap the gap remained and
the break was comfortably out of sight.
Having ridden the entire race right next to me, Etsu decided that racing for 5th place wasn’t good enough.
He went to the front of the race with Craig Goodstein and the 2 of them single handedly took 30 seconds out of the break.
In fact, their ‘super pull’ brought the break back into sight! Once the pack could see them, the chase was on and other
teams came up to join in. The neutral support car had to pull out and drop back after Etsu and Goodie’s pulls!
Sure enough, we came around the right hander that starts the finishing straight and the break was just up the road.
We started the final acceleartions and you could see the guys in the break working their machines to try
to survive to the line. With 250 yds to go, we swallowed the break and the sprint was on!
Then the requisite finishing straight crash came. Guys started pinballing all over the place. I was searching for daylight and
found it. My only problem was that I ended up behind a little guy who never really stood up to sprint! I yelled at him
to ‘open it up!’, but he didn’t. By the time I could come around him, I had lost a step on the other guys who also made it
throught the debris. I was nipped at the line and had to settle for a disappointing 11th palce.
The race dynamics were very ‘pro’, catching the break just before the line. I saw 2 riders come up and personally
thank Etsu for the incredible effort at the front to shut down the break. That was super cool.
Pics?
any spring series pics? results?
Silke! Congratulations on your win! solid solo finish! See you soon!!
gas prices
race fee entries
small prize lists
most 1/2 guys race 50-70 times a season and that shit adds up. while it’s true that nobody does this for a living most of us have to take into account the expense.
Ephrata is taking some people. They had a full 100 in P/1/2/3. Entry fees for Jiminy, Palmer/Sturbridge are low.
Bear 3,Masters filled faster than ever. 4’s took 10 minutes longer than last year. 40+ filled quickly. P/1/2 is closed 2 weeks before the race.
Bear p-1-2 closed early
Well, anything that’s got SBR (swim bike run) in it is still strong as McCaughnahey’s pecs.
Kona Volcano Climb filled up in 28 seconds. Which, incidentally, is just 9 seconds off my PR for the swim. Thank you, Speedo Shark suit.
Still time to register for the Crabtree & Evelyn/ Tory Burch Tour of the Milfs in Rumson, NJ in June ’09 — new course, lots of wind, custom power bar kitchen at feed station, loving it.
For those playing at home, signs this is a Cat 4 race report (without checking):
“sitting in the truck trying to decide what to wear”
“tucked in to the front middle of the pack for what I hoped would be an easy 60 mile ride”
“sitting in doing absolutely no work and I wasn’t changing my tactic for anything”
“My only problem was that I ended up behind a little guy who never really stood up to sprint!”
“I yelled at him to ‘open it up!’, but he didn’t.” (ok … laughing so hard im crying right now)
“settled for a disappointing 11th palce.”
“The race dynamics were very ‘pro'” (stop … uncle … youre killing me)
“I saw 2 riders come up and personally thank Etsu for the incredible effort at the front to shut down the break.”
I’m betting those two riders weren’t in the break. You see any break riders come up and personally curse out this Etsu guy for the Super Pull?
Teammates chase down a good break; set up other, polite, and grateful racers for the win; set you up for the 11th place while you’re shouting at the little guy who wouldn’t stand up to “open it up.”
I love you, Adam Duncan.
Superpull — when you wake up in the morning, do you say to yourself, ‘Boy I’m psyched to be a giant a-hole and crap on someone!’ or does it just evolve over the course of the day? Pls advise – I figure you for a life loser, shaky personal relations, mid-30s, large porn and Dungeons and Dragons collection…..
He’s none of those things. You need some pespective. Perspectivo. Adam D. too.
If Adam’s team was riding for a sprint (which they probably were, since Adam won the field sprint at Grant’s Tomb) they did everything pretty well…
But acted like a dink. C’mon. Adam writes some perfectly nice things about his race and a teammate and he writes some pompous anonymous cut-down as if he’s the second coming of Fausto Coppi.
Update please! Recruit any new Jedi mindtrick Cat 4s? Did you have a chat with Brad? Did your stable of riders dominate the podiums?
I like “the SuperPull” post. Adam’s post was ridic and I think SP did a good job of making fun of it without being too nasty.
Does anyone have more infor about the car accident on 9W?
What was the ridiculous part about Adam’s post — the part where he wrote a perfectly nice, informative report about his race and his team, or the part where he signed his name?
Does anyone have more infor about the car accident on 9W?
I finally saw some Bandit wine at a wine shop on the upper east. It was competitively priced at $8. We went to a new restaurant so it was BYOB. My family was not into the idea of boxed wine, but I gotta admit, it wasn’t bad.
Nice guys, and decent wine.
Go back to your regularly scheduled hate.
She was on the podium for both Sturbridge and Palmer in the Pro 12 W fields. Cool way to upgrade and still get results! Keep it up.
Marco you raced and place? 🙂
Adams post was fun to read and a good summary, including some perfectly frank language that recognizes that Palmer isnt a particularly challenging race in the 4s generally – not certainly a first couple of miles like Bear Mtn etc that might inspire one to exit a perfectly warm truck to sit on a trainer for no reason in advance of the start. If he planned to sprint for the finish as implied, then he just admitted that pack sitting was his legit strategy, and sound work by his team to support this. I did find the reply kinda funny, but only assuming the ignorance of the writer of the Palmer race.
Seriously though, there is no call to slam Etsu, who I also know is no doubt far more accomplished a person that the anon slammer, and a great guy and strong rider to boot! Go shit on someone elses parade you jerk.
You don\’t upgrade and immediately podium your first two races unless you\’ve been doing some serious sandbagging. Thanks for ruining Grant\’s Tomb and Battenkill for the all of the other hard-working 3/4s, MQ
Seems like Sturbridge was much more broken up than Palmer. Guys all over time wise. 3/4 had approx 20 DNFs. Was the new course that much harder? Palmer used to be the hard course no?
“Ruining”
That’s rich.
is definitely heading the right way. Junior gearing and still manages to beat us all. He was also very active throughout the races and this I am really only saying on hearsay cause I was always either right at the back or one from the back so I couldn’t see anything. Thanks very much for mentioning me even if only for the sake of mentioning me.
Had a pretty serious crash on the uphill going into the finish. A kid from the Wendy’s team was in very bad shape and Ted Neu, I believe, from Sids was in the crash and was helping stabilized the down rider. Well done Ted.
As far as I know, Palmer is the same course it’s been for years. Sometimes the start has been in a different location, and I think the finish was in a different location a few times too, but same loop. The direction of wind affects that race a lot – and I think there was very little wind this year.
The hill in Sturbridge was much harder than Palmer or compared to the previous Sturbridge course.
Palmer Sturbridge turned out to be a surprisingly good race weekend. Good races, good weather, good food, and good results. My Cat 4s turned in some good results though a couple got boxed in in the sprint on Sunday. Believe me, we’re working on box-avoidance techniques for the future.
But it was also a good networking/business development weekend. A number of you approached me at my car (I should start calling it the Coach L Mobile!) to discuss my coaching services. Boy was that banner a good investment! I’m always happy to talk to people with such entheusiasm for racing and training. I think a few might actually sign up for my level 1 service which is a great way for guys (and gals) to start since it covers the basics of training and recovery, and also gets you a complimentary tactics booklet I’ve put together over the years.
This season is already showing some real progress on all fronts and I couldn’t be happier to be back east!
Thanks everyone!
That’s funny.
“Thanks for ruining Grant\’s Tomb and Battenkill for the all of the other hard-working 3/4s, MQ”
It’s pretty obvious that MQ is one of the hardest working 3/4s in the city, and that hard work is bearing fruit. Very cool.
I would pay $20 to see that tactics booklet
box avoidance techniques
You don\’t upgrade to a \”2\” and immediately podium twice in one weekend at a major regional race unless you\’ve been doing some serious sandbagging.
I think ‘256’ (boldly named, missy…) is onto something here. From now on Im going home from every race and saying, “Honey, guess what? I won…assuming we exclude the 5 fastest guys since they shouldnt have been there ruining the race for the rest of us!” Sweeeet. Kinda like a triathalon thing, come to think of it? Hey 256, were you into Tri before this? Maybe go back to it – it suits you better….
Oh yeah, serious sandbagging – taking all the way till mid April in the season to upgrade. Whew. Any longer and we might even be into the meat of the actual season and well out of early spring!
Sarcasm dripping.
What! Rossler and Lacourte? No way!
Lets just review Grants for a moment. Number two was Dale Malkames from Scarsdale and would have won if MQ werent there. Of course this isnt guaranteed since the race would presumably have been different. Number three, Heidi Goodson of CRCA, squeeked a third place along with the pack. MQ gone wouldnt have given the win either, so again, nothing to complain about here frankly. So if its Heidi or Dale, go back to Tri. If not, then you are probably oblivious and happily winning by now in other races. Im just praying the complaints didnt come from further down the field, which would just be simply pathetic.
They make us weaker riders stronger. Take the 3s – Ernest Taukest, Bob German, Larose, Oddonnel, Friefelder, most if not all of them have the points to upgrade. But they push us and make us stronger. I like having the stronger guys in the races. Makes racing hard.
Not Dale. She is over 40 and has been racing for a long… time. COuld be a 2 herself but instead just races the Pro1-3 races/. Heck she may even be a 2. Dale has been racing for alot longer than most the guys in the Cat3s.
she was the number #1 ranked (cat 3) on the road since November. She won her first two races and a Central Park race too. she was like 50 points above the manadatory upgrade line. I think she should publicly apologize for the sandbagging, donate her winnings to the women\’s racing clinic, and we should all move on.
In other words, you mean for two months. Big whoop.
Friefelder won the Bethel Series, 2nd at Battenkill and was top 5 in a ton of races last year. Should he give up an winnings from this point on? Some people do not have the time and motivation to train for the next level. Its alot harder to finish a pro1-2 race that is 80 miles vs 45-60 miles in the Cat3s. Let these people have fun. Racing is hard because there are a few tough guys and gals. Without them its not hard and not fun. You might as well just do the Gimbels ride then and pretend your fast like all the out of shape guys on that ride.
Not backing the fact that an upgrade is in order, however, one could be #1 ranked in a given field simply by doing a lot of races. More so than many racing from Nov. til now.
Being called a Sandbagger is the ultimate compliment on this site. So sad!
Is there a “mandatory upgrade line”?
I haven’t been following rules details – is this really a rule?
I did a quick search of the USACycling site but don’t see it.
many “in shape” guys show up on the gimbels run. Maybe not consistantly but they show up.
Er…so you want Maria to hurry up and upgrade, so you can hurry up and upgrade, so she can beat you again?
Anybody have the results for Spring series ?
Is there a rule that you have to upgrade automatically after accumulating certain points? If not…leave MQ alone…for that matter anyone else. You try to lose more weight, train harder and do your best to beat her.
“She’s a 2 now after racing less than 2 years. Sandbagging or talent? Keep it up MQ.”
well said, but it’s talent PLUS hard work
What’s up with the Cadence Cup this weekend? Is it true they’re giving away a three-bedroom Tribeca condo as a preme?
but please don’t say everyone else is sucking. that is unfair. we all know training to be competitive takes a lot of time and dedication. some of us just don’t have the time because of other things, like, say children.
20% racers using the ride as a supplement to their solo training and 80% weekend warrior sitting in, dropping like stones on the hills and showing off their latest carbon bike with tubulars. Fun ride but not the best training.
I have to say, he is one of the strongest cat 3’s I have ridden against. I respect his strength as as rider and his aggressiveness. He always maintained great positioning and responded to most of my attacks. I have to apologize for not working with him the number of times we had gaps in the road race and the crit. It was just not the team game plan for the weekend. Still, great job by him and he was certainly the strongest rider out there and deserved his wins. Nice Job!
a couple (thats TWO!) of fast 3s show up to Grants and these women are moaning about it months later. So pathetic. You cant win every race – sometimes fast riders show up and remind you that you arent ‘all that’. Get over it. The season is young, and MQ already upgraded so whats to complain about?
….we all started as Cat 5’s and moved up. Congrats to MQ, Filip, and all of those who are working very hard to improve. Turn the magnifying glass on yourself (for those who feel compelled to critique or insult others). If you have something useful or nice to write,then do so…but ‘don’t chop off someone else’s head to make yourself look tall’!
3-2: 25 points in any 12-month period
40 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
George G. got 2nd in the Overall overall. If not for his selfish trip to Spain he would have won the Overall overall.
Page 5 of:
http://www.usacycling.org/forms/USAC_rulebook.pdf
Road Upgrades Guidelines and Notes by Category:
5-4: Experience in 10 mass start races. Local Associations may also establish policies where upgrade credit is given for taking a sanctioned rider education clinic.
4-3: 20 points in any 12-month period; or experience in 25 races with a minimum of 10 top ten finishes with fields of 30 riders or more, or 20 pack finishes with fields over 50. 30 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
3-2: 25 points in any 12-month period 40 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
2-1: 30 points in any 12-month period 50 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
Enough with the personal threats or we will beat YOU with a clip board…
for all the guys who get worked up and downright indignant when someone might be sandbagging or not – what do you do in your regular lives when your boss asks you to work late or the Chinese food guy is late? You do tend to bring a lot of emotion to what is basically a hobby. Albeit a great, fun and expensive hobby, but a hobby nonetheless…just wondering.
no pics of me… godammit
My chinese food guy is never late.
It’s me late getting off my trainer to let him in…You are right, though, that’s a good point. It’s a hobby, sometime we take it too far with these comments
MQ is sandbagging the P/1/2 field!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=CMwdAc1Dzfg&feature=related
I don’t think it’s wrong to want people to act fairly in all aspects of life. I want my kid’s opposing soccer team to be composed of kids in the proper age group, I want the delivery guys to give me the right change, and I want my bike racing to be done with people who belong in my category. Is that so hard to understand, Brian?
people like MQ is playing the unfair game? What’s unfair about that? So she sticks around to collect more wins, is that REALLY unfair? If someone wants to stick around a while before moving up to the different level, it’s his/her progative so long as it’s within the rules, no? It’s not like Lance Armstrong decided to downgrade to cat 3 and started kicking our ass. I think people like MQ legitimately worked hard, train hard and raced hard to earn her points. If she wants to upgrade only after she feels comfortable to be with teh Pro12’s, let her be and if that means enjoy a few more victories to boost confidence, so be it. Others had better work harder!
Don’t forget there are also so mant guys upgrading with VERY shady record…and I find that much worse.
that the proper people should be riding in the proper fields, but there’s a point in which the gnashing of teeth and rending of garments borders on the ridiculous.
You’d also bring a lot more credence to your points if you identified who you were. Otherwise you just appear to be a bitter, anonymous, and dare I say cowardly, poster.
Brian G., -1 for Argumentum ad hominem. What one chooses to enter in the “Comment By:” box is not germane to the quality of one’s arguments.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PW6veiA7hvk
The rulebook says 40 points is an automatic upgrade. Does that mean a mandatory upgrade? My interpretation is that the local rep has some discretionary powers over upgrading and is allowed to reject someone who has the minimum number of points. But, once the person reaches the automatic upgrade threshold, the local rep must approve the upgrade. This is not the same thing as a rider being forced to submit an upgrade once they’ve reached the automatic upgrade threshold. I may not be reading the rules as intended though.
“Don’t forget there are also so many guys upgrading with VERY shady record…and I find that much worse.”
I don’t understand what is so much worse about that. If someone wants to do tougher races, who is it hurting? I remember a few years ago a 4 in CRCA snuck into one of the big cat 3 races (Mengoni I think) and placed. Sure it’s against the rules so we shouldn’t encourage it, but it shows some balls and is kind of cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwB9m4FslO4
“I don’t think it’s wrong to want people to act fairly in all aspects of life. I want my kid’s opposing soccer team to be composed of kids in the proper age group, I want the delivery guys to give me the right change…”
I got some news–life ain’t fair. Is it fair that Lance always beat Jan? Is it fair that you will never beat MQ no matter what categories you or she are in? Is it fair that “the delivery guys” may never get the opportunity to buy an expensive bike and race it?
Back in the day, there was a “professional cat 3”, aka sandbagger, here and there. (This did not include anyone who had been racing for only 2 years, by the way.) These racers were never really vilified–you either ed out how to beat them and eventually moved on, or you stayed a cat 3 and hoped they went to a different race, for crying out loud.
If that doesn’t work, think about someone living in Iraq or Darfur right now, then go enjoy a ride on your bike while thinking how fair your life is–and don’t forget to give the delivery guy a nice tip.
Where in the Rule Book that you cannot use PP,Cp as Upgrade Points ? I know you cannot use a Club race as upgrade point,but if pp,cp meet the required miles and riders it can be used as up grade points.Thats why Van dunk increase the laps in his races so people can uses his races as upgrade points.Mengoni Race,Lou Maltese race etc.
Last year the validity of using some of the local non-crca races was up for debate. Now that the rules are more clear all the open races count just on varying points scales
http://www.usacycling.org/news/user/story.php?id=580
I like it when my son’s soccer team annihilates an opponent.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=unsw-3-r-lY
When will we find something else to fight about?
Ok. I’m a jerk, but I’m honest. So this week I congratulate Reed A. Good result for a big boy like you on Saturday on that hilly new course. This week, no moose banana for you. But I’ll be watching the results. Don’t make me sprinkle you with moose dung.
I don’t know this MQ person, but I love how she has the flatlander women all worked up about her. I bet she’s better than most cat 4 men in NYC. Ha.
Pro 1,2,3
1 Lisban Quintero CRCA/Foundation Cycling Maspeth NY
2 Rafael Meran GS Mengoni Fort Lee NJ
3 Jonathan Erdelyi Rite Aid Pro Cycling Bradley Beach NJ
4 Jermaine Burrowes We Stand United (W.S.) Brooklyn NY
5 Thomas Bencivengo Sommerville Sports World Team Brooklyn NY
6 Ryan Oelkers Cadence Cycling Wynnewood PA
7 John Durso Liberty Cycle Morris Plains NJ
8 Alejandro Guzman CRCA / FOUNDATION Sunnyside NY
9 Salvatore Scotto Divetta Sommerville Sports World Team Brooklyn NY
10 Roselvert Marte GS Mengoni Fort Lee
To answer JFT, you do have to upgrade after a certain number of points. It’s 30 I think for men… I assume it’s the same for women. And to those of you saying that we are freaking out that fast women showed up to the race… we just think they should have raced with the 1/2/3 field, not the 3/4 field… which should be just a 4 field, but isn’t because they have to limit it to 50 riders if it is. There’s a huge difference between 3s and a lot of the 4s no matter how hard they train. Same in the men’s field. Ideally, the 3s would have a separate field. But Heidi G, Dale and Maria and any other 3s should grow some courage and race with the Pro 1/2/3 field. Get out of the 3/4s and allow the good 4s to upgrade. That’s all people want is to race in categories against a reasonable set of competition.
thank you, Amazed.
Thank you, IDIOTS! What was the field open to? 3s and 4s…what did her license say? 3…aside from a crash that took out the top riders in the first corner, the race was still a field sprint, FCOL!!! Its not as if she lapped the field and won every prime? She won a field sprint with arguably a diminished field due to the crash!!!
Maria deserves credit for learning HOW TO WIN, not simply follow the wheels in front??? It is no wonder to me she immediately gets results in regional cat.1, 2 races. How many critical of her have even gotten to the front, let alone off the front, or even result??? Unbelievable!!!
Maria is the next up and coming rider! As if Womens racing has overflow of support as it is!!! 90% of Womens racing is uncategorized??? Give her a break! I applaud you, Maria, for WINNING and continue to do well. That shows you are ready to go much further!
There’s a bike race at Bear Mtn in 2 weeks, not in Darfur. Cat 4 riders will have a better chance of staying together without Cat 3’s fighting for upgrade points so they can get into the 1/2/3 race which they already qualify for. Unfortunately it doesn’t work to allow self selection, so it’s mandatory and some Cat 3’s will be hurt. But this makes things a little fairer for the large number of new Cat 4’s.
Linkman:
And now for more news of the momentous artistic event in which Pablo Picasso is doing a specially commissioned painting for us whilst riding a bicycle. Pablo Picasso – the founder of modern art – without doubt the greatest abstract painter ever… for the first time painting in motion. But first of all let’s have a look at the route he’ll be taking.
Cut to Raymond Baxter type standing in front of map. A small cardboard cut-out of Picasso’s face is on map and is moved around to illustrate route.
Baxter:
Well Picasso will be starting, David, at Chichester here, he’ll then cycle on the A29 to Fontwell, he’ll then take the A272 which will bring him on to the A3 just north of Hindhead here. From then on Pablo has a straight run on the A3 until he meets the South Circular at Battersea here. Well, this is a truly remarkable occasion as it is the first time that a modern artist of such stature has taken the A272, and it’ll be very interesting to see how he copes with the heavy traffic round Wisborough Green. Vicky.
Cut to Vicky, holding a bicycle.
Vicky:
Well Picasso will be riding his Viking Super Roadster with the drop handlebars and the dual-thread wheel-rims and with his Wiley-Prat 20-1 synchro-mesh he should experience difficulties on the sort of road surfaces they just don’t get abroad.
Linkman:
And now for the latest report on Picasso’s progress over to Reg Moss on the Guildford by-pass.
Reg Moss standing with hand mike by fairly busy road.
Reg Moss:
Well there’s no sign of Picasso at the moment, David. But he should be through here at any moment. However I do have with me Mr Ron Geppo, British Cycling Sprint Champion and this year’s winner of the Derby-Doncaster rally.
Geppo is in full cyclist’s kit.
Geppo:
Well Reg, I think Pablo should be all right provided he doesn’t attempt anything on the monumental scale of some of his earlier paintings, like Guernica or Mademoiselles d’Avignon or even his later War and Peace murals for the Temple of Peace chapel at Vallauris, because with this strong head wind I don’t think even Doug Timpson of Manchester Harriers could paint anything on that kind of scale.
Reg Moss:
Well, thank you Ron. Well, there still seems to be no sign of Picasso, so I’ll hand you back to the studio.
Linkman:
Well, we’ve just heard that Picasso is approaching the Tolworth roundabout on the A3 so come in Sam Trench at Tolworth.
Cut to Sam Trench at roadside.
Trench:
Well something certainly is happening here at Tolworth roundabout, David. I can now see Picasso, he’s cycling down very hard towards the roundabout, he’s about 75-50 yards away and I can now see his painting… it’s an abstract… I can see some blue some purple and some little black oval shapes… I think I can see…
Pepperpot:
That’s not Picasso – that’s Kandinsky.
Trench:
(excited) Good lord, you’re right. It’s Kandinsky. Wassily Kandinsky, and who’s this here with him? It’s Braque. Georges Braque, the Cubist, painting a bird in flight over a cornfield and going very fast down the hill towards Kingston and… (cylists pass in front of him) Piet Mondrian – just behind, Piet Mondrian the Neo-Plasticist, and then a gap, then the main bunch, here they come, Chagall, Max Ernst, Miro, Dufy, Ben Nicholson, Jackson Pollock and Bernard Buffet making a break on the outside here, Brancusi’s going with him, so is Gericault, Ferdinand Leger, Delaunay, De Kooning, Kokoschka’s dropping back here by the look of it, and so’s Paul Klee dropping back a bit and, right at the back of this group, our very own Kurt Schwitters…
Pepperpot:
He’s German!
Trench:
But as yet absolutely no sign of Pablo Picasso, and so from Tolworth roundabout back to the studio.
Linkman:
Well I think I can help you there Sam, we’re getting reports in from the AA that Picasso, Picasso has fallen off…he’s fallen off his bicycle on the B2127 just outside Ewhurst, trying to get a short cut through to Dorking via Gomslake and Peashall. Well, Picasso is reported to be unhurt, but the pig has a slight headache. And on that note we must say goodnight to you. Picasso has failed in his first bid for international cycling fame. So from all of us here at the ‘It’s the Arts’ studio, it’s goodnight.
David Jordan and a whole bunch of other coaches who are the real culprits should get some perspective. Neither Maria, the other Cat 3’s nor the Cat 4 riders we are talking are going to be stars. Maria is doing great and should be proud of her success but she is not going to be doing the NRC circuit. Unfortunately she got started too late for that but she can do very well in club and regional races and really enjoy cycling. But it’s not that important that she win a Cat 3/4 race especially when her participation and that of others changes the dynamic of the race and eliminates a lot of the new riders chances of not getting dropped . The importance being placed on learning to win especially when it’s at the expense of fair play and the enjoyment of others is really out of whack. Using the excuse that life is unfair is silly and shows something really unbalanced in our approach to this sport. It’s good to take it seriously and train hard but don’t forget that you’re doing this for fun.
If racing to win is what you call racing? Then a “culprit” I am…
Not at all costs, not to take drugs, not to screw other peoples lives, name calling, BS that most of this “scene” seems to be thanks to anon. poster children.
Just wanted to clarify last post I wrote, that I happen to have seen first hand Maria race at Grants Tomb if that was not obvious. I have ridden with her, but I am not her “coach”.
The only thing wrong that I can see is that a 3 can even use a 3/4 combined field for upgrade, but no fault for Maria to race it and yes even win it…and she didn’t embarrass anyone in the process. She raced FAIRLY and with DISTINCTION.
…she is now a cat.2 and already placing. Maybe there might be something to that, racing to win sort of thing. It is bike RACING, not bike riding last time I checked…At least don’t complain about someone doing well, FAIRLY.
How do you know she won’t place in an NRC race? If not this year then next perhaps…EE started late, and got 5th at Worlds after some very tough years of sacrifice and SUPPORT later! Imagine if someone tried to tell her, “you’re too old to do anything worthwhile”…yeah right!
How do you know Maria won’t win Masters Nationals or some other “big” race someday? What makes you such a judge of cycling talent or timing? By your account Marie De Rosa would never had gone to Master Worlds and WON, Deirdre Murphy wouldn’t have gone to the Olympics, or Masters Worlds and WON, or Ken, Ferdie, Ann Marie, just some in the CRCA. We all started late except for about 10 juniors, and only one local made it a career in Europe! If you don’t go pro or race a full NRC calendar, then it doesn’t mean anything, or what? There are many bike racers that make many sacrifices to do well in the name of personal development, not money or fame, or category upgrade for that matter…there are no sandbaggers! Only people that do at a level they are comfortable.
(….) yourself to try to personally bring Maria, or myself, down.
Enough…you know where to find me.
kidpantyhose, I feel some Monty Python coming on, but not entirely sure it was that trip…
nuff said, nuff said…
say no more, say no more…
CRCA women have done amazing stuff.
Here’s a picture of a CRCA woman on the podium of an NRC race
http://www.jt10000.com/team/tgal/wil99podium2.htm
and a sprint from that race, with another CRCA woman getting top ten
http://www.jt10000.com/team/tgal/wil99sprint2.htm
Tara, who got sixth there, is a great rider but didn’t appear on the cycling scene as a huge bomb – she improved bit by bit by bit. I have no idea of Maria Q’s goals or interests or life situation, but we can’t say it’s not possible she won’t be that good or decide to try doing lots of big races. Who knows? That’s the beauty of sport. Cat 4 to cat 2 in two years is pretty good progression.
> To answer JFT, you do have to upgrade after
> a certain number of points. It’s 30 I think
> for men… I assume it’s the same for women.
Eloy quoted the rulebook and “not JFT” offered an interpretation that disagrees with what you said, but you think you know the rules, so I guess we should follow youre feelings….
> But Heidi G, Dale and Maria and any other 3s
> should grow some courage and race with the
> Pro 1/2/3 field. Get out of the 3/4s
> and allow the good 4s to upgrade.
“Grow some courage”? Is that a diss? Maria went from 4 to 2 in two years and raced a 1-2-3 race this past weekend. So I guess she eventually grew some courage, but not fast enough for whiney people.
And now you want “any other 3s” to stay out of 3/4 races? Wow.
Here’s the thing – bike racing is about losing. It’s a sport where 30 or 50 or 100 people get beat and a handful feel they did well. That’s the nature of the sport. There are almost always stronger riders. If you can’t handle that, bike racing is not the sport for you.
If someone is trashing other lower cat riders week after week, then maybe we can talk about sandbagging. But it’s simply inappropriate to suggest that someone who has only been racing a couple years and happens to be better than you or does things right and wins should somehow get out of your race.
> Ideally, the 3s would have a separate field.
Sure, but it seems your beef is with with the reality of there not being enough riders to have more womens’ fields of good size with separate categories. The way around it is to see what’s possible in getting more women to race so there can be a 1-2, and a 3 and a 4.
More women who came into racing through CRCA and did a lot of NRC races:
http://www.jt10000.com/team/tgal/zonkers.htm
http://www.wonderwheel.com/cycling/team/ashley.html
http://www.richardsachs.com/articles/cybccatpowers.html
and others
with some of these, like Catherine, immediately displayed huge talent. Some revealed their talent more slowly
two wins in p-1-2-3 races from different riders (plus an overall series) plus two other riders getting top ten
can you post the results again?
MQ rode the 1-2-3 at Grant’s Tomb too. She did two event there
This thread, as much or perhaps more so than others recently, illustrates the need for logins to prevent anonymous attacks on decent people. Of course the number of postings and consequently the hit rate will drop significantly, but that’s better than giving the anonymous scumbags an open mic. Dan, Andy, Alex, is this site really so lucrative that its worth spreading all the poison?
“Using the excuse that life is unfair is silly and shows something really unbalanced in our approach to this sport. It’s good to take it seriously and train hard but don’t forget that you’re doing this for fun.”
Doing this for fun–exactly. My point about fairness was that it’s all relative, and to get worked up about whether your competitor is sandbagging is low class and has nothing to do with developing your own talent or having fun. I assume MQ played within the USA cycling rules or she would have been disqualified, so in that sense, fair is fair. The fact that she is more genetically gifted, and/or trains harder, and/or is more race savvy than the people whining that she beat them, maybe it’s unfair that we don’t all have the same physical or mental makeup, but it sure makes for a more exciting race. If you want totally fair, ride time trials against yourself for the rest of your life. Don’t expect to see your picture on NYvelocity, though.
David and JT have in a sense won the argument. They have defended Cat 3 riders right to ride down to learn to win in a Cat 3/4 race. Technically they are right. I think this is against the interests of Cat 4 riders. There are coaches who have placed emphasis on learning to win in a 3/4 race. I think that’s wrong considering the number of new women riders. So no Cat 3 riders will have the opportunity to ride down in races I’m involved with.
I’m all for learning to win and developing competition. But do it in the field that most challenges you and doesn’t interfere with others trying to learn the sport. No offense is meant personally against Maria.
Mr. Green is totally off base, and Im not entirely surprised given that he doesnt race himself much and never went beyond Cat 4 to my knowledge. If he thinks that a 3 racing in a 3/4 race is somehow unfair to the 4s then he should consider why the field was combined at all. MQ was in the process of moving up, and is doing nothing wrong at all in racing in a race where she can be competitive, rather than trying to place in a 1/2/3 event to get points – a bit of a stretch I would think even for a strong 3 to assume this is going to happen. Consider further that she is just starting the season, and that she hasnt “killed” the field in any event, and its tough to argue she is a sandbagger – no – its not even possible to argue in my view. Mr. Green is just wrong here, and has essentially admitted it I guess. He is confusing real sandbagging (a rarity around here in acutal practice – most get called that like MQ after a couple of wins, inevitably directed from the 4s below hoping to move her along so they can win for a change without real competition). The whole discussion is stupid, and a 3 racing “down” rather than getting thrown into the lion pit with Cat 1-2s is doing nothing wrong at all. Maybe only the case when the rider gets so strong they are clearly needing to move up, but it has been noted repeatedly here that its EARLY SEASON and nobody has even had enough races to be accused of anything. To include a few CRCA races in spring or spring series races is just idiocy. These are not yet the real deal in the heart of the season. MQ upgraded before all this crap even started, so she is innocent of any blame. Get off her back. Oh, and Green, maybe think a bit harder about what a combined field means. If Cat 4s want to get points as a primary goal, they can race Cat 4 races to be more assured. If MQ dropped any riders from her brute strength, I suspect those riders have a lot of work to be strong enough to eventually place in any race – with ot without a strong 3 in the mix. Fact, my man.
Foundtion had great wins this weekend. But the 12+ guys left in the pack at prospect after Igor and Scott broke away rode like morons. It was an embarassment to lovers of red faux fish scale kits everywhere.
is that it causes you make the tone of what you’re saying appropriate to the discussion
anonymous posts can too easily be way too harsh – harsh when it’s not appropriate
For the 4->3 upgrade you don’t even NEED points. You can do it on pack finishes, top 10s, whatever. And it’s even more relaxed under the new rules so far as I can tell. So who CARES who’s in the field in a 3/4 race. You only benefit in the long run from racing against faster men and women. And some of them are 4s…look at supposed sandbagger George Gyarmathy!
Will O, Maria Q, the eternal James Joseph…whoever. Whatever their reasons for being there I really don’t see the problem with it. It doesn’t prevent any 4 who wants to from becoming a 3, and very few 3s, relatively, are interested or have the ability to become 2s. So let ’em sandbag.
We are part of a small community of bike riders/racers who love to be outside, push ourselves and be competitive in races. Why can’t we just be happy when others do well, instead of brooding and passive-aggressively posting stuff on nyvelocity. Maybe this is just the New York way, but it really makes me sad. I go to the races, and I’m always so happy to see the same faces every week, talk to people who have become my friends. Then I have to wonder if any of them are the jerks posting crap on this site. This is for FUN. You should be leaving these races with a big smile and feeling good – not getting pissed off when someone else does better than you in an amateur bike race! You all sound like unhappy people!
I would imagine a whole different outlook on lifestyle and training comes into play when going from 3>2. Much more intense and committing to the sport than just racing here and there.
Does Odonnel need to put dr. when he signs his name? You’re a chiropractor for christ sake, you’re about as much a doctor as a dentist. I apologize to all dentists.
Yes, foundation rode a fabulous race while all the fast local guys were at belleville…..Somehow that seems less impressive.
You’re a broken record with the name thing. How about each time you’re inclined to post about it you just drop Dan and Andy an email instead and spare the rest of us?
Didn’t Foundation win Belleville also? This is a team sport, you know…
I didn’t make that post calling for an end to anonymous posts on this page – though I agree with it
My only comment on anon dumbasshery was the one “a reason to…”
“How about each time you’re inclined to post about it you just drop Dan and Andy an email instead and spare the rest of us? ”
Don’t post anonyomously you dumbass
I laugh when I hear u losers criticize people like KH, Will O., JJ and Maria Q.
JJ is over 50 f’n years old!
If you are a 3 why is a 3/4 off limits? Nobody calls Doug O’Neill out for winning in Masters 50+ races over and over. Why? Because he is over 50.
The guy that ripped Duncan’s race report is a jerk. Take my word for it.
Only gets ripped because he calls himself a Doctor. Nothing to do with his racing.
why people rip on him for anything is beyond me. he’s entitled to call himself dr. (and he’s strong as shit). why do you haters care? anybody who gets ripped on this site has done something GOOD to be a target. i only wish i was good enough to get some anonymous hate directed my way
He is not only strong but often puts his race second for the good of the team. He definitely sacrificed a top 5-10 at Battenkill to give his teammate a leadout. Guy loves to ride and race and we shit on him because he is good and puts his name out there. Seems like a guy every team would want to have. Keep it up Will
The problem people seem to have with Will O is the endless stream of self promotion coming out of WV. If those guys learned a little humility they’d have much more praise heaped on them.
deserves to get ripped on. He shows up at Floyd and wins the 3/4 every year. He should step it up and compete in the 1/2/3. Does he have the right to race the 3/4 – yes. After winning it for multiple years, should he move on – yes. He has certainly competed and beat fields stronger than the 1/2/3 Floyd in the past. This is not to take away form his greatness during his waning years, but because of it.
I wish I was good enough to get anonymously slagged off on the pages of VelocityNation.
Stop the hate.
People were saying J. Joseph was a sandbagger, a pro cat 3, back in the early nineties. Go ahead and ask an old-timer, it’s true. Hey, that’s his lot in life, and all your moaning ain’t gonna change it. If you can’t beat a guy in a 3/4 race, get your 2nd place points and upgrade and start taking names in the 1/2 field.
Now that FBF now counts for upgrade points as a crit, if he continues to win on such a consistent basis, won’t he get automatically upgraded?
40 points in 12 months is automatic upgrade. FBF should be at least 5 points for the win, might even be 7 with a large enough field. We’ll be keeping an eye on his results.
I have come to the view that having JJ around in the FBF pack isnt all bad at all, and its his right as long as he is allowed by the rules. Its true that having him there forces the rest of us to try harder to get away, and to set up a race where he cant win. It actually makes it a better training race to have a strong sprinter in the pack, so we dont just sit around in the final laps resting our legs for a dumb sprint of the un-mighty. If I were him, Id probably race up at some point (it would get boring to win over the same people so many times in the same situation), but whatever – its his little sandbox and he likes it. For the rest of us, its a chance to train hard and try attacks that might not happen otherwise. Last season, having tried both races (now for ’08 I guess I have to race 1/2/3 as an under 40 Cat 3), the 3/4 was way more fun and just interesting vs. the “faster” field races. More teams, more team tactics, and actually faster much of the time. All this due in part to JJ. Thanks JJ, you sandbagging fixture! Without you the race just wouldnt be as fun. I mean it.
PS…
The guy Id rather see gone from the field is the long dreadlocked rider. It just amazes me how someone can race for years and still manage to be such a scary pack rider. Maybe he got better over this winter…but I guess its not my problem anymore as I get punched in the sack repeatedly in the 1/2/3s.
JJ is not a real sandbagger because he has a built in handicap in his age. It\’ your problem if you can\’t beat an old guy. The women\’s field has a similar strong, but older, rider that is a perma-3 in Betty Tyrell and no one complains about her. O\’Donnnell is not a real sandbagger because he has only one real race (Mengoni- TTs and BB are not real races). MQ won Sturbridge 3/4 last year and was like 70 points above the mandatory upgrade. When she raced (and won) her first 3 races this year as a 3 she was sandbagging.
on whether the “mandatory upgrade” meant you have to upgrade, or that the official can no longer use his discretion and must upgrade you, if you request it. If the latter is true than JJ would not have to upgrade.
is a sandbagger because he has won the 3/4 field multiple years in a row, and many years in the past. His age entitles him to race it. His superior ability to the field enables him to be titled a sandbagger. In addition, I agree it can make a race more interesting, but it does take away upgrade points from those who are not sandbagging.
JJ is 50+ years old, my dad’s age. that’s freaky. doubt it’s easy to maintain fitness consistently into your 50s
On a completely different note did any sandbaggers (or anyone else for that matter) see a black knapsack left around after the Prospect Park race? It contained very wet and kind of smelly Champion Systems kit and a set of keys that I need. I have contacted Anthony who has indicated no one turned anything over to him.
Thanks
Marc Adam
“doubt it’s easy to maintain fitness consistently into your 50’s ”
probably not so difficult if you are an olympic athlete and continue training all those years like JJ. But even if you don’t have that kind of talent you can at least hang in races pretty well into your 50s if you train for it.
Most people over 35 are decrepit because they are sedentary.
not be easy, but the point is: if you dominate a category year after year, you may want to upgrade, or race the higher category race you are eligible for. If you choose not to, you might be considered a sandbagger, which obviously does not offset the financial or egotistical gains awarded for continuing to dominate the lower cat races.
I believe that Doug Oneil is in his 50’s and handily beats guys half his age. There are some other local guys in their 50’s who haven’t slowed (much.)
The 50+ champion on the Sids team regularly shows up in the b-races and cat-4 out of towners and stomps out guys left-n-right.
There’s a huge difference between the 3/4 and 123 races at FBF. JJ may be a sandbagger for remaining in the 3/4 field for so long but he’d get dropped most nights in the 123 so I don’t blame him. It’ll be interesting this year to see if the increased packfill in the 123 race changes the dynamics much.
that JJ interview is long overdue
Log-ins would be nice. But then we’d have nothing to discuss. It would be like this:
Cranky: Hi JFT. How are you? How’s that saddle sore treatin you?
JFT: Oh hi. It’s not a really a saddle sore because the saddle didn’t cause it. It’s a minor abrasion on my taint caused by friction between the skin and synthetic microfibers in my chamois. So it’s more of a synthetic microfiber sore. But it’s not too bad this year, thanks for asking.
Cranky: Wow, that sounds like a saddle sore to me. You sure are a slave for detail.
JFT: Yes, I am. I read that’s one of the 46 habits of successful employees of successful people.
Chris M: Did someone say taint?
Everyone: NO. Go ride your bike.
M. Green: Have I mentioned that I have a hard on for Cat 4 women and I’m trying to arrange the fields so my friends can win and I look like a nice guy?
DJ: Come on Mike. You don’t need to do that. If they just worked with me I could get them to upgrade in like 30 seconds.
Bullwinkle: Hello everyone. My name is Phil and I’m from Vermont and i come in last a lot but find some comfort in making fun of you guys because you get so worked up about it. I’m also gay and have a crush on Reed A.
JFT: Welcome, Phil. And congrats for coming out of the NYVC closet.
Connor Sallee: Fuck you guys. I rule.
M. Green: I don’t know DJ, you coaches seem to be over emphasizing upgrading at the expense of race dynamics. And I could really use some, so would you mind budding out?
Alan Atwood: Whatever guys. The track rules and I’ll never let you hold Bear Mtn on the day before mother’s day because i hate all of your mothers and want them to suffer. It’s also the day of Sterling and my friends run Sterling so I don’t want to diss them. So eff your mother. Oh shit. This isn’t anonymous anymore! Um. Oh. Um. I was, um. Just kidding. Gotta go.
Dr. William O’Donnell: No worries Alan. I don’t even have a mother. I come from the Planet HC. Here’s my power file from the 12 x 30 minute AT intevals I just did. I rock.
WV Sycophant: Hey Will. You rock.
JFT: That power file doesn’t make much sense to me. Seems like you might do better if you rode a harder gear at a higher cadence.
Ugli: Hey there guys. Has anyone seen my bike? I lost it sprinting. I don’t know what happened to it. I was sprinting at Prospect and admiring my legs and the next thing i know I woke up in the hospital and my bike wasn’t anywhere to be found.
Bullwinkle (aka Phil): Your so hot Ugli. To bad you can’t sprint. Oh shit, this isn’t anonymous anymore!
Bunde: Are you guys still mad at me.
Bremer: yes. But I have a hot new girlfriend this year so who cares.
Cranky: You sure do, Alex. You sure do.
As you can see, it wouldn’t be much better with the logins. So let it be.
well done
Phil’s GAY!!!! HAHHAHAHA
I hate anon posters; I want to know who wrote that long script ’cause that was some funny stuff, you effin’ anon mother…… 🙂
forget the anon posters you have enough on your plate already worrying about making sure Goldman gets his top 30 finish properly recorded.
there are better things to mock me on
have I ever talked training with power on this site? have i ever even talked training on this site?
*Maybe* the second (I can’t recall, but it’s possible). Never the first
There’s some sort of projection going on there
“was like 70 points above the mandatory upgrade.”
70 points over? Or even 70 points? Can you back that up.
Beyond what is possibly confusion over mandatory vs automatic.
with all this talk I would think more people should be riding then writing….it’s pretty nice out. (lol)
Fu*king all time, that was funny. Made my morning.
I just wanna see a pic of myself the next day looking cool on my bike. LOL
Damn this thread got long
Where am I on the photos page?
I keep placing toward the back
Where are pics of me on the attack
Against the last four in the bunch
Where are pics of me, me, me?
My $7,000 bike, two shorn legs and me!
Hours I’ve spent trawling cyberspace
But nothing, nada, no me, me, me
Where are pics of me, me, me?
I’ll take my own pics and post
Of me, me, me and more of me, me and me