Today’s weather notwithstanding, I can’t help but notice that we have some very nice autumn days in the Northeast, meteorologically speaking; and then I received an email from a local race promoter (from his private yacht – purchased, of course, with all those race entries, bwa ha ha ha ha!) that wondered why we don’t shift the racing season back about a month. The idea has a lot of merit. Instead of starting races in late February, when the snow can threaten to fall from the sky, why not shift the early season to late March and race through September and October? Would you race now if there were a season ending race series? Would you rather be racing cross with its "laid back vibe"? (And is every cross race description obligated to be described as "laid back"? I need to know for my internet bike writing standards manual.) Would you be afraid to sacrifice the early season fitness gained by racing in the cold, dark mornings of March? Is 55 degrees warmer in the fall or spring? Would you be burned out at this time of year no matter when the season started?
the cross vibe is definitely laid back and friendly. the racing is super hard, there’s nothing laid back about it. but it’ll all floats away after the finish line.
…however all of the type-A NYC types are eager to show off how many hours they sat on a hamsterwheel^H^H^H trainer and can’t wait the extra month.
race entries would probably be anemic, especially with CX gaining popularity
I don’t see cross as being laid back anymore, unless you are doing a local race, such as Sussex. 80 guys gunning for a whole shot is no where near as laid back as gently rolling away at the beginning of a race.
I agree. It’s become a mini-roadie scene, with dudes taking it very seriously. I’m going to start a new sport, maybe unicyclocrosstrialsdownhill racing. Naked.
Have to make sure no promoters had any races in Feb-March or that would blow the whole reason. You’d have to MAKE the NYC racers WAIT so they’re itching to race in April rather than race over icy/snowy conditions.
It will never happen. Promoters want the $$$ and all the bigger East Coast “classics” start in April. You need race miles in your legs unless you’re Lance Armstrong circa 2003 when he went to mountain “training camps”. Not the Lance now who needs race miles…He’d need to do Spring Series then the Giro.
-Ryan
What we’d really like would be a NYC cross series. all the laid back vibe of cross with the convenience of a CRCA slugfest.
while the vibe is chill, no way is a cross race laid back. more like a 50 min tt on an obstacle course. if you don’t feel like puking 8 min in, pedal harder. like racing a crit, only being off the front for the entire race.
There could be a 3 cross races in nyc if there was a course… .
How about racing series around Kissena Velodrome. There used to be some races there back in the days.
* 3 cross races a week
i am only fast in march and september.
I say don’t push back, but extend the season by a few races with a new series — I think the “season extender” market could be there. For example, I thought there were decent fields for Senia even with an iffy forecast and the hordes, supposedly, racing CX. I know my legs are strongest just when the calendar’s drying up.
At the same time, I look forward to March racing to make myself fast in a more appealing context than huffing and puffing up 9W by myself.
Personally, I think ‘CX will always be just a niche. I don’t like getting so dirty — that was for other kids in the sandbox. But imagine the full autumn day — a Prospect or Central race early in the morning, then jump in a car to race midday ‘cross out in the burbs.
road is not fun anymore, y’all need to let it go. Go ride a trail on a ccx bike and enjoy life.
speak for yourself CX hippie
Wout, hello, we live in a city — at least I do. Where are these trails in Brooklyn that you speak of where I can toodle my anxieties away? Jumping in my car to fight Sunday traffic on the Deegan or the Turnpike with a bike on my roof doesn’t count.
Fact is, a road race in a city park is my workout of choice — convenient, timely and satisfying; sets me up for greater goals elsewhere. There are hundreds of others who agree with me.
The turnout for Fall Bear and Catskills was not good. Rather than seeing the Fall season extended we might see it cut back because of the lack of interest.
Why does it always fall on the existing promoters make racing more accessible to everyone? As a promoter, I’d love for others to step up and take on the job of putting on a race, but I’m not sure many realize the personal commitment required to pull off a great event. A CX series would be GREAT in NYC, but week after week of race promoting is costly, time consuming, and I just don’t have enough time or energy (or extra cash) to rob from my professional and family life to do more than StatenCX.
i would like to hear more about the days of yore, like ’92 or whatever, when road was totally fun and cross was so aggro that there were six guys in the field and you had a 40% chance of leaving with either a stab wound or VD. won’t you tell us again?
Agree with comment below. Cross is laid back in that 50% of the guys dont care where they finish. They just want to have fun, get a good workout and drink a beer or two. The other 50% want to win or top 10. Its really a reason to get dirty and own another bike and more gear.
The big races are definitely intense – Granogue, Whitmores, Mercer Cup. Cross races (especially Bs) that have 100 starters are very intense. I think the local stuff is the way to go. Keep it within an hour driving. You can race with about 30 starters and two races. I think the best thing about Cross is you dont have the wheel sucking and all the crap and noise that goes with a park road race. The races starts and blows apart 1 minute in.
CX people are cycling’s version of Scientology; always going on about how they’ve reached new levels of happiness and the rest of us just don’t get it. Plus they publish a lot of bad writing.
I think one reason some of the roadies dont race CX is simply because 1 minute into the race it shows them how unfit they are. Its alot easier to sit in a pack of 75 guys in a park race putting out 175 watts for 45minutes and then saying how they average some crazy speed… man I am fit!
What ever you think about CX (good, bad, stupid), its the best 45minute workout you can do on a bike hands down. It also helps with your bike skills. Something many of us need.
Apparently, it doesn’t help with grammar.
When I think of cyclocross, I think of big, mullet-wearing, gap-toothed hairy Belgian women that look like linebackers, serving up nutella crepes and mugs of beer with an infectiously warm smile that says, “Oompa loompa schmorgeddy borgeddy bork bork.”
Wait, what was the question?
early spring races tend to be super cold, which I hate.
Grammar police. Anyone typing on this squid board care a shite about grammar.
For those who want to start their season early they should and for the rest of us (myself included) we can start in May and avoid the really junk weather. Leave it as it is and let the racers decide whether or not they want to come out and play.
CX- Harder racing (45 minute TT with obstacles is a good description) but the people who attend and race cross tend to be a little more personable.
Everyone should come out and try it at least once- getting a little muddy is fun.
it’s just that i prefer to ride my bike than to carry it.
It attracts a certain type who still want to race, but are looking for a change, like the seasons. For roadies it’s a welcome change from the intensity and danger of road racing. It also seems to attract itinerant Mt Bikers looking for a break from their 2-3 hr beat downs.
…like april-august. Way too cold in March and only true maniacs can race on the road 8 months a year without feeling burned out.
meant to say
Gimbels. I have about 25 top 10s this year. I even been Will S once from a break.
Not sure why the results have not been sent to USA Cycling. I need my upgrade points.
Cold later winter racing vs. warmish fall racing. No question — would LOVE it if the season shifted a month.
First CRCA race March 8th…cold, cold, cold. And forget about when it rains.
Be freakin great to still be racing road now.
There are hundreds of bike racers in NYC, but only a handful of promoters. If people want more races, they need to get involved with promoting races. When you only have a couple of folks doing a bunch of races, they eventually get burnt out and races start to disappear.
Push the season back a month and you’d have higher registration at fall races like Bear and Catskilss (well not catskills because its 3-days). There aren’t that many C/X races anyway, no reason why i wouldn’t race C/X on sunday and road on saturday etc.
What races do the non-CRCA and non-kissena NYC teams promote. I thought it was a requirement of all teams to promote at least one race. What race does Champion or Mengoni or BVF (i think i might remember them doing one) or WS united, or Toga, or Sommerville promote. Some of those teams might put on a race but I don’t think they all do.
this is nice and all but what happened to the crank-length argument. that never got cooking the way i was sure it would.
Pushing the season back a month or two would be a smart idea if the schedule were determined by one person. The season is front-loaded because promoters make their own decisions and have the incentive to schedule events whenever racers will show up and pay. Come February, most of us will have gone 5 months without racing and will be chomping at the bit despite the terrible whenever. Even if a few promoters agreed to hold off until April, someone else would inevitably organize races in March and most of us would attend. And as usual, exhaustion would set in 6 months later despite the nice fall weather.
Mom! Meatloaf! Fuck!
http://usacycling.org/clubs/index.php?state=NY
With SO MANY teams in NY State, it’s very surprising we don’t have 4 races per weekend 12 months out of the year! There’s actually close to 30 teams in the NYC-Metro area, yet CRCA, Kissena, Squiggle, and Charlie I are the only guys putting on races. That’s bullshit.
But maybe if everyone actually had to put on a race, we’d just see fewer teams instead of more races.
Make anything more difficult and fewer people will do it.
i think it is a uscf rule that all teams must promote a uscf event, but it doesn’t seem to be enforced & I can’t find it on the uscf website.
getting a permit to hold a bike race is incredibly difficult unless there is an existing tradition of having a race in a certain location on a certain date. this year CRCA (?) tried to start a new crit both in Coney island and McCarren park in Wiliamsburg but in the end wasn’t able to make it happen. Governor’s island was a little easier because there’s never any traffic there but even they only permitted one hour at a time.
1E6. Sponsorship. Any affiliated road or track club in good
standing which has promoted a race open to members of
other clubs in the current or previous calendar year shall be
eligible for sponsorship.
(b) Advertising may appear only on the uniform, including
caps, shoes, and helmet of riders who are racing members of
sponsored clubs [disqualification for other advertising]. The
club’s name must appear on the front and back or two sides
of the jersey. The name may be abbreviated.
So… where are the officials on this one? It seems like most teams would be subject to these rules considering the bylaws. Why have rules if everyone breaks them?
Mengoni = Mengoni
the other teams ussually team up with a race promoter and do some volunteering at the race and donate supplies (drinks, food, man power). They then meet their race requirements. Its really a silly rule to force a team to put on a race. If you are a rural team (Adirondacks) there are only so many racers to even attend your event. Not really a reason to put on an event in some areas if the racers and towns are not interested.
i agree, there’s no need to force clubs to do a race… do you really think there aren’t enough races?
Ok, so what about:
Affinity Cycles
BKLYN 911
Brooklyn Velo Force
Capala Brothers Racing
Deno’s Wonder Wheel Cycling
Sommerville Sports
Team Tam
The Coffee Den
We Stand United (W.S.)
Bard High School Early College
Chelsea Bicycles Team
GS Gotham
Innovation Bike
Keirin.US
Kraft Genie Cycling.Inc.
New York University
Terrier Tri
VO2maxOut.com
NYC Velo
Oh who gives a flanksteak. BUT WHY NO TURKEY RACE! I wanna see Jeff King in a Favre Vikings shirt.
Come ON Dumb Dumb. Its like your stupid or something. Charlie, Gerg, AVD and CRCA put on race’s because that’s who the parks department will allow to do a race. Maybe Sommerville could do one but the limited spots on the calendar for bike races might make it hard to find a spot for him. The rest of us have no creditability to put on a bike race with in the city.
http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/other/story/1269317.html
1:58: That is some serious mom meatloaf action, right there. Dude, get a hobby.
VO2maxOut.com doesn’t put on races because Will S controls EVERY RACE
There are 2-4 races every weekend within 1 hour of NYC or closer from March to October. How many races do you need.
Spring Series
Bethel spring and summer
Ct Coast Crit
CRCA
Prospect Park Summer Series
FBF Tuesdays
Kissena Track
NJ Summer Series in Rockland
Bear Mtn Spring and Fall
Various TTs
Harlem Crit
Grants Tomb
Tour De Parc
Unionvale -1.5 hours
Housatonic – 1.5 Hours
Gimbels/Spoon Race/Rocket Ride – Just kidding
Staten CX
And if you want to drive 2-3 hours the list is endless. Most people across the country have to race 2 hours min to race a few times a month.
I’ll answer that in a minute. “MOM! THE CAT JUST POOPED AND IT SMELLS DOWN HERE IN THE BASEMENT! SCOOP THE FUCKING CAT BOX MOM! AND BRING ME A DIET COKE!”
What were you saying?
wholly poo my weenz growing thinking about all these races, lolz.
many of those “teams” are one guy with a custom kit…really they are riding unattached.
or collegiate teams. or teams that don’t exist any more. etc. etc.
Suck my Ween LOLZ United…
New team for 2010 with some big names
Going to be sick!
ON this topic – new discussion where all the hot new Cat4s going next year team wise?
Nice local races.Now put that bike on the plane and do a real OUT of town race. See if you should hold that Cat 1,2,3 license with harder competition.
US Crit series-real race
Chris Thater Race
Bank of America Wilimington DE
Tour Of Sommerville
Kelly Cup
Joe Martin Stage Race
Etc
Why does mostly all NY cyclist have the same set of races on there resume,PP,CP,Branchbrook,FB ?
Spring Series- Easy
Bethel spring and summer-Easy
Ct Coast Crit-Easy
CRCA-walk in the park
Prospect Park Summer Series-whatever
FBF Tuesdays-flatfest
Kissena Track-go to indiana better track
NJ Summer Series in Rockland-nobody showes up
Bear Mtn Spring and Fall-(B-)
Various TTs-Tri-GIRL stuff
Harlem Crit-still locals
Grants Tomb-still locals
Tour De Parc-where is the challenge
Unionvale -1.5 hours——-Ok
Housatonic – 1.5 Hours-OK
Gimbels/Spoon Race/Rocket Ride – wack
Spring Series- Easy
Bethel spring and summer-Easy
Ct Coast Crit-Easy
so you won all three, eh?
i think my favorite was “go to indiana”
you, my friend, are a dick.
Brought to you by NRC eye for the local Cat1-3 guy. Likely never to have ever placed (top 10) in any NRC race.
Did I hurt your feelings.Your pride and joy race is a Win in Prospect Park,give me a break.Like I said EASY,you must be a cat 4 or 5 and your mad i didn’t say your Category.Your weak thats why.
you forgot to say a$$clown.net
please learn the difference between your and you’re and don’t use them interchangeably (not that I expect you to know what that word means)
dick
oh, and yes, I am a loser Cat 4 and agree that people should race out of town, but your (not you’re as in you are) “list” is just fucking stupid
Just a stupid Troll trying to get a rise out of people. Likely a local cat4
we really needed some clarification as to whether chris thater or the pete senia memorial was tougher.
i like it when someone says something so out there and fucking ridiculous that we can all rally behind letting him know how fucking dumb it is.
The point isn’t more races or longer season, it’s starting the road season later and finishing it later. In other words let’s match the road season to the local climate instead of scheduling a bunch of races for what amounts to Winter months, and having half of them canceled by ice and snow. Never happen, makes too much sense.
you all are not drinking or getting laid enough, redtube doesn’t count. Don’t come back until you’ve had a last standing at the end of the bar evening or 3…
Mommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!
Meatloooooooooooooaffffffffffffff!!!!!!!!!!
3:06-answer
3:15-answer
3:19-answer-
3:23-answer
3:27-answer-A$$clown
3:36-answer
All the Cat 4’s who answered.B*T*H*S
Does the truth hurt look at your own race resume ?
Have a Nice Day !!!!!!!! Have to go and train for Spring Series.
like our local races, and are happy not to sleep on couches in dog dick towns and live on nothing so we can race “real” races.
thats why this site is called “NYvelocity” not “Division III domestic pro-locity”
Bunde’s suspension is up next week, no?
Did not know he raced? Thought he just read biggems magazine… Can I get a Wooh Bunde!
http://www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/elizabeth-hatch/the-year-of-wtf#
Interesting blog post on Cyclingnews. 1. seems Ms Hatch may Troll this site and was upset about some people calling her out for being a less than stellar “Pro” racer.
2. She seems to be taking a page from the Real Connor Sallee playbook by calling out sponsors on a much larger scale.
Pretty good stuff.
it’s called “lurking” on a site. not trolling. big difference.
I’d still hit that and twice on Sunday. But not during the early spring races since I peak for those.
cat 4 squiddy
she never mentions this site, you guys are nothing
maybe her teammates were jealous because she doesn’t have a beefy bottom bracket and instead is sculpted like a fine fillet braze…
Wasnt she engaged to some young Norwegian pro on B-Box? What happened with that… WTF?
Yep, Tom Stubbe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Stubbe
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/races09/sixday09/gentpez-rbg.jpg
start the season in march, as per usual, then come mid-summer cut a couple weeks of races there, then add them to the end of the season.
started my long rides out to 9w, well, I’d kill to race in this weather!!! Its a shame that no one wants to race anymore as evident by senia memorial approx turn out. But whatever, I guess this is what Northeast cycling is all about. Race in shit weather in the spring to be competitive for the big late spring/early summer races elsewhere.
in regards to the go to indiana comment, no way dude, go to t town!
Stevens=Streep, Hatch=Kardashian
Stevens = Milovich
Hatch = M. Fox
or Stevens = Red Head on SITC
Hatch = Hot Nymph on SITC
or Stevens = Foster
Hatch = C. Diaz
Wholly Pooh, that wind was forreals!
for shizzle my nizzle
This One Time At Band Camp
sitc?
The advantage of the current season is that there is at least one really nice month to just ride your bike without worrying about racing (if you only race road). If we pushed back the spring races, the off-season would completely overlap the worst weather of the year. March racing may kinda suck, but it’s still a lot more fun than cold, early spring miles up and down 9W.
It’s called cross. Stop being such a pussy and get out and do it if you want to race in October.
Looks like a fun course, good weather and close to the metro area. Oh and you get to eat Waffles!
Nonsense Schmaltz.
Start the season 2 weks earlier, say 2nd weekend of February at FBF/PP and extend the season thru end of November, say Alpine TT series Sep 1 thru Thanksgiving and FBF Fall series on weekends, including TTs and/or TTT. Since people come out to FBF, make it worth their while and combine RR and TT in one session.
October fitness doesn’t carry into the next year. One year I rode a century on October 1 and got a ‘roid (not steroid). No, wait, I got the ‘roid from drinking too much Milwaukee’s Best and wiping with the worst kind of TP – should of used baby wipes.
I love Liz Hatch. If she were my girlfriend, every day would be like Festivus: Pole, Dinner, Airing of Grievances, and Feats of Strength.
If you meet the Central Park Conservency’s requirements, you too can promote a race. It has nothing to do with CPC only trusting CRCA and AVD. There are probably empty slots that could be filled with bikes races if someone asked. The Parks department limits each promoter to 15 races a year. If you recall way back when CRCA used to put on more races than that every year. The deterrent to promoters using CP for races is the requirement to have at least 40 marshals in the park. Paying 40 marshals quickly eats into your budget.
Spring series start 2/28.
Smallie,
Please begin your training log asap!
the march-sep road racing season is long as it is. no need for change…
I would race from january to january if I could.
So, it seems that there were a lot more local club races early in the season 10 years ago comparative to now. Also, there are less local club races then 10 years ago. I prefer the earlier season to the latter. Why have we changed the ending of the season to September then November? I really liked the Turkey race. I used to look forward to riding that race and talking about the season gone by. A suggestion which was shared once before was to have winter single gear races. Cutting out 110th street hill. And on a side note I truly miss having ITT and TTT in the park. It appears that there are more running races scheduled early during our usual time slot in the park and that we have lost race events do to situations that accidentally occurred. It is really unfortunate to see certain changes. Not everyone has the opportunity to hit all outside races and therefore looks forward to the local seen. Hopefully next years schedule of events will be slightly different. Have a good winter break…
I miss the Times Square trolley and 5 cent talking pictures! Pass the Pepperidge Farm, son!
the New Years Day “Race”
Have it on weekends at a reasonable late morning start. I’d go for that. I suspect many non-burned out flatlanders who skipped GMSR/Catsklills would go for it too.
Winter single speed races sounds really fun-Fast pack riding on your winter ride…. but keep the hill at 110th.
CRCA, and othe promoters, have to work with the Central Park Conservancy when deciding on dates. There are times when unanticipated conflicts occur and schedules need to change.
CRCA is limited to 15 races in the park, so when CPC asks for a change, CRCA will get another date in exchange. So no one loses out. You should get in touch with the CRCA board if you want to know why the turkey race was cut out of the schedule.
track racing in PP at 9 pm
it’s funny that you call it “track racing”
it’s really hipster racing, guys that think they’re fast because they deliver food or commute to work
Moved to Off Topic
Fuck! great race...
when it is 20 degrees in January!
Want more racing try Mountain Biking. Season starts in April ends in late October then go right into Cross.
If you primary is Road use MTB races for intensity when there’s gap’s in the road schedule. Do it right and you’ll still be motivated for Cross. Drop the excuses and get out there!
there are no gaps in the road schedule
Sofiane Stiff, you crack me up. The top five finishers in the A field the past two weeks have likely dusted most of NY city road racers at least a few times just this season. Don’t knock it if you don’t know it. 🙂