Side Mount Pedals

by alex

Section head text.

The dropped pedal concept, where the foot is in line with (instead of above) the pedal axle, simply makes sense. If lower stack height is better, then no stack height must be best, right? One unnecessary lever is removed from the pedal stroke, eliminating some slop as your foot rocks while pedaling. The idea is so mechanically sound that you’d think they must be more efficient. Things get more complicated, however, when the concept is applied in real life.

First of all, the pedal bearings have to go somewhere. And unless you’re going to have titanium axles bionically implanted in your foot (are you listening, Ken?), those bearings will have to be between your foot and the crank, pushing your foot outboard. Vista has an integrated pedal/crank unit that solves that problem, but it’s expensive and, as far as I can tell, not available in the US.

Side Mount Pedals

I got to test Steve Lubanski’s Side Mount Pedals for six months on my TT bike to try the dropped pedal idea for myself. The SMP has a little round knob that spins on bearings for a pedal, and a cleat that wraps up and around the inside of the foot. A spring loaded ball bearing in the pedal takes care of retention, and an allen set screw adjusts the spring tension. The knob/pedals add about 1 cm a side to your Q factor. Because of the dropped design, you’ll have to lower your saddle to compensate. Coming from Speedplays I had to lower my saddle 15mm. Other pedal systems require up to 20mm’s of adjustment.

The ball bearing in the center of the red circle is the retention mechanism. A set screw, visible inside pedal spindle, pushes a spring against the ball bearing to adjust tension.

The pedals are pretty difficult to clip into. After many attempts at clipping in blind (and many gouges on my carbon cranks) I gave up and resorted to looking. Clipping out can be difficult as well, and it exposes one of the SMP’s inherent flaws. The SMP is the only pedal I know of where you clip in/out in a direction tangent to the pedal stroke. This means you’ll have to find a retention tension (retention tension, why the apprehension –Schoolhouse Rock!) that’ll keep you from unclipping while pedaling and still allow you to unclip quickly in traffic. I did suffer one humiliating topple in midtown Manhattan, as well as a few white knuckle encounters with cabs. Even worse, I popped out a foot twice while standing on bumpy descents. The unexpected falls to the saddle were pretty scary. Lubanski tells me he has his pedals set very tight, but has no problem unclipping. I never found a compromise that kept my feet clipped in while riding and let me unclip easily in an emergency.

There were upsides, however. Pedaling action was noticeably smoother. Dropping the saddle made the TT bike more stable and easier to handle. It might also make you more aero. My second ride on the SMP’s was a two TT torturefest of a day, with 20k at Floyd Bennett Field and 40k in New Jersey. And while I managed to inflict unspeakable pain on myself, my joints emerged unscathed, proving that the increased Q factor was at least safe.

SMP, on left, sits lower, but wider.

Another noteworthy ride was the Silvermine TTT in which I teamed with Jon Orcutt and Dmitri Wilkins, and was the weakest link by a mile. Aside from the first 30 seconds where I was left behind while desperately trying to clip in, I really appreciated the SMP’s. Being lower on the bike meant I was completely ensconced in Jon and Dmitri’s draft, and able to grab massive amounts of recovery whenever I dropped back. My superior aerodynamics really became apparent on the downhill finish. I started the downhill run in third position, but had to coast to the front to avoid rear ending them. I took a pull and dropped back to third, and again coasted to the front. At that point I realized that it was futile for me to sit in the draft on a downhill, so I pulled us in to the finish. It sucks to be the weak link in a TTT, and I was grateful for every little advantage I could muster.

Testing

Finally, I booked a lactate test with Mike Sherry to see if we could detect any of the efficiency gains that Lubanski claims. Since I had to do two consecutive runs, Mike shortened the test by increasing the wattage steps. We shot for four five minute intervals at 150, 200, 250, and 300 watts, all at 85 rpm. Since the SMP’s were supposed to be more efficient, we ran the Speedplays first. That way we could rule out fresher legs if the SMP’s tested better.

What followed was pretty surprising. At the time of the test, I had already spent five months acclimating to the SMP’s. And while my results for the season were pretty lackluster, I thought they were reflective of my spotty training. I completed the first run on the Speedplays as expected, rolling through the 250 watt interval at 165 bpm and 3.4 millimoles of lactate, and completing the 300 watt interval at 181 and 10. Not spectacular, but normal for October.

The first two intervals on SMP’s were normal. My HR was a little higher, but lactate levels were almost identical to the Speedplay run. At 250 watts, however, I began to suffer. I finished at 172 bpm and 5.2 millimoles, well into my threshold zone (threshold lactate is typically 4). The 300 watt interval was pure torture, and I failed after 3:14, at 181 and 8.4. Mike noted that my knees were visibly wobbling, clearly not aligned under my hips. It seems that once pedaling force exceeded a certain threshold my pedal stroke broke down and became very inefficient.

The first incline is the Speedplay run, the second SMP. You can see a much higher lactate reading at 250 for the SMP’s. I couldn’t complete the 300 watt interval on the SMP’s, so the lactate number wasn’t as high.

An Unsatisfying Conclusion

So does that prove SMP’s suck? Well, not exactly. If anything, I proved that on the continuum of hip widths, I’m closer to the ‘non child-bearing hips that mother-in-laws hate’ end of the spectrum than the ‘Idaho senator in denial’ end. But it seems that Q factor is pretty individualized, so you can’t simply state that narrower is better for everyone (check out this biketechreview thread). Also, the lower rpm’s of the lactate test increased the force needed to generate 300 watts, accentuating the misalignment of my hips and knees.

So after six months of racing and training I can draw no conclusions about dropped pedals. Sure, they feel nice, but I have no idea if their simplicity translates to real wattage gains. I do know that Side Mount Pedals aren’t for me and my narrow stance. Now if I can only get those Vista people to answer my emails…

124 Comments

Anonymous

a somewhat expensive way to lower stack height, but keep q factor with speedplays is to get Rocket 7 shoes with their special speedplay drilling. Between their thinner carbon sole and the lack of the speedplay adaptor plate that you no longer need, you get a significantly lower stack height. I have used this for over a year and like the set up.

Anonymous

Rocket 7 at 180 grams a shoe? I have the semi custom; stock size, custom footbed, and speedplay drilling. They’re stiff, comfortable, and crazy light.

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Anonymous

Excellent example for illustrating that the RPE correlates very highly with both power output AND lactate measurement (in a relative sense). For me, the takeaway message is the results/conclusions would not change had lactate been omitted. “Field testing” showed that 250W felt harder with the SMP’s and that 300W wasn’t complete-able. Lactate analysis contributed nothing and was meaningless without power to correlate it to.

And a quick question Andy: Did you alter bar positions for the test to maintain “other” angles? (Perhaps the higher power requirements were made more difficult as a result of “closing” the angle at the hip)

Jame

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Anonymous

I have to admit I don’t understand the first paragraph. I hadn’t perceived the difference while riding, and I don’t race with a power meter, so I don’t know if my power was down in races. Also, had it not been for the lactate numbers, I might have just thought myself a wuss for not completing the second 300 watt interval. Can you clarify what you meant?

I couldn’t drop my bars any more without getting a adjustable stem, so I just left the bars as is. But my hip angle was more open with the SMP’s.

Anonymous

The no stack height pedal had him lower his saddle. Keeping his bar at the same height would make his hip angle more open not more closed.

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Anonymous

Andy,
You’re absolutely right about the hip angle…my error. Regarding the testing, you stated that at 250W you “began to suffer” and 300W “was …torture (and you) failed” after having ridden with the SMP’s. This would have been enough evidence for me that the SMP’s made generating as much power harder and that Speedplays were my choice for power generation…had you performed the same test with the Speedplays again, you would have found a slightly different lactate profile the second time from the first while still finding power easier to come by. Using the lactate measurement to determine wussy-ness is not IMO necessary OR dependable…ie., does the fact you reached “only” 8.4 mmol as opposed to 10 indicative that you tried harder the first time or that the second time you wussed?
Mike

Anonymous

Ah. I only reached 8.4 the second time because the interval was cut short. Who knows what number I would’ve reached after 5 minutes? So 10 vs 8.4 is not a conclusive comparison. I find perception so unreliable (even though in this case it correlated), and I think the results would’ve been less persuasive to most people if I merely stated “it was harder on the SMP’s”.

Anonymous

In doing tests, I often find that I go into them with a pre-conceived bias. I usually root for the product to be good. In my homemade wind tunnel helmet test, I wanted my sponsor’s helmet to win, and had to try very hard to be neutral and accurate when taking measurements. In this case, I think it’s good to have a number (lactate) that I can’t consciously control verify the outcome. I went into this test expecting the SMP’s to win, so I’m sure we would’ve tested and re-tested if I was just relying on perception. I think we would’ve done the test 1 or 2 more times before I trusted my perception.

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Anonymous

…although you rode them for 6 months on your tt bike, i would assume you ride a road bike w/ regular pedals a good bit more…should simple physiological adaptability be considered a factor regarding your power output ?…is there just enough of a difference in extension or range through the 360* that your legs & hips won’t easily accommodate the motion simply due to lack of experience (regular training) in comparison ?…

…i remember seeing the smp’s 3 years ago at the show & immediately thinking that it ‘seemed’ like a sound bio-mechanical concept…you & mr zinn concur on that aspect & also on the fact that the smp’s unwieldy attachment function can be a problem…it stands to reason that bearing load would also be problematic…

…sweet talk vista into a test of their version for the road bike although it’s obvious cornering clearance will be a compromise…
…cheers…

Anonymous

During that period I make a concerted effort to ride the TT bike a lot. I think I did most of my hard rides on the TT bike, so it was something like 3 rides a week. Lubanski says that there should be no adjustment period

Anonymous

about lactate…a simple search on pubmed.com will return numerous studies that show repeated bouts of exercise will alter lactate levels in subsequent bouts…
For example: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=17540836&ordinalpos=20&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

This one is particular means it can’t be used to determine “wuss factor” in repeated bouts even 3.5 hrs apart…

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=9662681&ordinalpos=8&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

I know you’re not submitting this for peer review, but this “test” was flawed from the onset…doing it after the speedplay trial on the same day…and tossing in the “red herring” of lactate doesn’t prove anything. That the tester doesn’t know this speaks volumes about his use of lactate data. (period)

Anonymous

Well, I’m not a scientist nor do I claim to be one, the conditions of the test are laid out for you and you can draw your own conclusions. There is no question that the methodology of the test is flawed. We talked about re-testing in reverse, but quite frankly, I didn’t want to spend the money (nor endure the pain again). The difference was big enough that I was convinced the SMP’s were less efficient for me, but given the sequence of the runs I couldn’t say how much definitively.

And I still don’t get why lactate is a red herring. I understand that it can drift (which is why we ran what we thought would be the more efficient pedal second), but I don’t get why such a huge difference is insignificant.

Also, this shouldn’t reflect on Mike Sherry. The test was my idea, his contribution was to set the zones. So if you’re going to say someone doesn’t understand lactate, that would be me, which I freely admit.

I don’t mean for this to seem argumentative, I’m genuinely interested in what you have to say. I tried to read those studies but they made my head spin. Did they mention the magnitude of drift in lactate?

Marylyn

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Anonymous

Unfortunately, to read the entire study, you gotta pay the $$ and I don’t remember the difference in Lactate…I no longer have “free” access…And TBH, my insistence on the lactate issue is in response to what seems to be a trend recently pushing expensive testing that, in reality, offers no additional information to the athlete/coach. By correlating RPE,the dependent variable composed of the sum of many physiological “things”, like lactate accumulation, heat stress, recent training load, etc. that are going on in the athlete to the actual indepenent variable, power (which are, by the way, variables can be compared day-to-day like you’re in a rolling lab)the performance team can make adjustments/gauge training.

I think that certain athletes have come to an epiphany (and rightly so, IMO) that Coggan’s L2 (<75%) as established by 40K power doesn't do as good a job pushing "endurance" or "the right" up as effectively as spending more time in the L3 (75-90%)and the fact that the 1 mmol LT is "in" here seems to support the case (ie., this point goes 'up' with training in this range quicker).

Anonymous

I think I understood about 60% of that. I’m really not that interested in exercise physiology, and I don’t understand too much of it.

I think what would be significant is how much lactate drifted in those tests, and if it drifted as much as mine did. Also, those tests were 30 minutes at 70% of vo2peak, while I spent 5 minutes at tempo and 5 minutes at threshold.

I’m boring myself now.

Gerald

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Anonymous

today I rode in the park trying out a pair of Sidi Hydro GTX winter shoes (I had been trying unsuccessfully to sell them new, but no luck so I finally decided to try them). Of course, I had to use the speedplay adaptor plate and with the thicker soles, I had a much higher stack height than the Rocket 7s. Cleats were placed in roughly the same position as the Rocket 7s. This was my first ride not on the Rocket 7s in a year and a half. My initial feeling with the higher stack height was pretty uncomfortable. Anyway, my riding in the park recently has been endurance zone riding with average speed between 18 and 18.5 mph. Today with the higher stack Sidis, I rode an unstructured ride in endurance, tempo, and subthreshold zones and despite higher heart rate and perceived exertion than my endurance zone rides, my average speed today was a measly 16.2 mph. Sure seems like I’m putting out significantly higher power with the lower stack height Rocket 7s.

On a side note, I was pretty disappointed with the Sidis in terms of foot warmth. My feet were just as cold today in the Sidis with 2 pair of wool socks as they are on 40 degree days in the Rocket 7s with toe covers and booties.

Anonymous

seems doubtful that the width of an adaptor plate could bleed off 2mph avg speed like that…was it also a windy day?
or not feeling well otherwise?

Anonymous

I’ve been getting over a virus and off the bike for a week, but I don’t think I lost that much in a week. Today was in the low forties and not particularly more windy than the past several weeks. I think part of the loss was not feeling quite up to par and part was the stack height. I do recall getting a bump up in my average speed on endurance rides in the park when I got the Rocket 7s, but it certainly wasn’t 2 mph.

Rhea

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Anonymous

…sorry, i kinda dropped the ball here…
…you’re quite right…i was ‘imagining’ that the extension was in the fore & aft positions rather than 6 & 12…
…not thinking clearly or hallucinating madly ???…wouldn’t be the first time for either, i’m sure…
…i do hope you get to test the ‘vistas’ as i still like the ‘axle @ ball of foot’ concept & it would be interesting to see how a more natural clip/in clip/out accommodation might be viewed…

…wishing you guys a happy, good riding new year…

Anonymous

thats the stupidest pedal design ever. the pedal has to compensate for flex now at the angle, instead of applying pressure directly to the axle. what sort of power loss comes from a flexing pedal, as well as putting all the torque onto the bearings instead of the axle. The traditional pedal has worked for over a hundred years, and theres a reason for that.

Delila

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Anonymous

Of all its flaws (and I think there are a few), flex is not a problem with these things. The cleat is pretty sturdy. Like I said before, I can’t comment on bearing wear, except that I wasn’t able to ruin them in six months. You’d expect shorter bearing life with this design, though.

Normal pedals aren’t immune to flex either.

I don’t like the ‘it’s worked for hundreds of years so don’t try to improve it’ line of thought. I like people like Lubanski who try to find a better way, even though I think this pedal is a near miss.

Anonymous

I’ll admit I like innovative stuff but this contraption seems like another doohicky to piss cash out on. This sport can be a real wallet mine field of widgets and doodads. With all those #”s, that I dont get, and all the graphs and charts you’ve posted – this thing makes me want to just run and hide!!
Speedplay please!!!

lee

I’ll admit I like innovative stuff but this contraption seems like another doohicky to piss cash out on. This sport can be a real wallet mine field of widgets and doodads. With all those #”s, that I dont get, and all the graphs and charts you’ve posted – this thing makes me want to just run and hide!!
Speedplay please!!!

Andy

Of all its flaws (and I think there are a few), flex is not a problem with these things. The cleat is pretty sturdy. Like I said before, I can’t comment on bearing wear, except that I wasn’t able to ruin them in six months. You’d expect shorter bearing life with this design, though.

Normal pedals aren’t immune to flex either.

I don’t like the ‘it’s worked for hundreds of years so don’t try to improve it’ line of thought. I like people like Lubanski who try to find a better way, even though I think this pedal is a near miss.

Abboberg

Flex IS a problem with these pedals – the harder you push, the more the ball bearing and pedal droops due to ball climb in the bearing race. Ball bearings are designed to be used in pairs, not individually. You will not only get flex under high loads, you will get very low service life.

I recall Core Wheels (inline skate wheels) single-bearing construction – they were a disaster due to instability and very low service life.

Arne B. Boberg, P.E.

Anonymous

thats the stupidest pedal design ever. the pedal has to compensate for flex now at the angle, instead of applying pressure directly to the axle. what sort of power loss comes from a flexing pedal, as well as putting all the torque onto the bearings instead of the axle. The traditional pedal has worked for over a hundred years, and theres a reason for that.

bikesgonewild

…sorry, i kinda dropped the ball here…
…you’re quite right…i was ‘imagining’ that the extension was in the fore & aft positions rather than 6 & 12…
…not thinking clearly or hallucinating madly ???…wouldn’t be the first time for either, i’m sure…
…i do hope you get to test the ‘vistas’ as i still like the ‘axle @ ball of foot’ concept & it would be interesting to see how a more natural clip/in clip/out accommodation might be viewed…

…wishing you guys a happy, good riding new year…

Abbie

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Jay

I’ve been getting over a virus and off the bike for a week, but I don’t think I lost that much in a week. Today was in the low forties and not particularly more windy than the past several weeks. I think part of the loss was not feeling quite up to par and part was the stack height. I do recall getting a bump up in my average speed on endurance rides in the park when I got the Rocket 7s, but it certainly wasn’t 2 mph.

jp

seems doubtful that the width of an adaptor plate could bleed off 2mph avg speed like that…was it also a windy day?
or not feeling well otherwise?

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today I rode in the park trying out a pair of Sidi Hydro GTX winter shoes (I had been trying unsuccessfully to sell them new, but no luck so I finally decided to try them). Of course, I had to use the speedplay adaptor plate and with the thicker soles, I had a much higher stack height than the Rocket 7s. Cleats were placed in roughly the same position as the Rocket 7s. This was my first ride not on the Rocket 7s in a year and a half. My initial feeling with the higher stack height was pretty uncomfortable. Anyway, my riding in the park recently has been endurance zone riding with average speed between 18 and 18.5 mph. Today with the higher stack Sidis, I rode an unstructured ride in endurance, tempo, and subthreshold zones and despite higher heart rate and perceived exertion than my endurance zone rides, my average speed today was a measly 16.2 mph. Sure seems like I’m putting out significantly higher power with the lower stack height Rocket 7s.

On a side note, I was pretty disappointed with the Sidis in terms of foot warmth. My feet were just as cold today in the Sidis with 2 pair of wool socks as they are on 40 degree days in the Rocket 7s with toe covers and booties.

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I think I understood about 60% of that. I’m really not that interested in exercise physiology, and I don’t understand too much of it.

I think what would be significant is how much lactate drifted in those tests, and if it drifted as much as mine did. Also, those tests were 30 minutes at 70% of vo2peak, while I spent 5 minutes at tempo and 5 minutes at threshold.

I’m boring myself now.

mike

Unfortunately, to read the entire study, you gotta pay the $$ and I don’t remember the difference in Lactate…I no longer have “free” access…And TBH, my insistence on the lactate issue is in response to what seems to be a trend recently pushing expensive testing that, in reality, offers no additional information to the athlete/coach. By correlating RPE,the dependent variable composed of the sum of many physiological “things”, like lactate accumulation, heat stress, recent training load, etc. that are going on in the athlete to the actual indepenent variable, power (which are, by the way, variables can be compared day-to-day like you’re in a rolling lab)the performance team can make adjustments/gauge training.

I think that certain athletes have come to an epiphany (and rightly so, IMO) that Coggan’s L2 (<75%) as established by 40K power doesn't do as good a job pushing "endurance" or "the right" up as effectively as spending more time in the L3 (75-90%)and the fact that the 1 mmol LT is "in" here seems to support the case (ie., this point goes 'up' with training in this range quicker).

Andy

Well, I’m not a scientist nor do I claim to be one, the conditions of the test are laid out for you and you can draw your own conclusions. There is no question that the methodology of the test is flawed. We talked about re-testing in reverse, but quite frankly, I didn’t want to spend the money (nor endure the pain again). The difference was big enough that I was convinced the SMP’s were less efficient for me, but given the sequence of the runs I couldn’t say how much definitively.

And I still don’t get why lactate is a red herring. I understand that it can drift (which is why we ran what we thought would be the more efficient pedal second), but I don’t get why such a huge difference is insignificant.

Also, this shouldn’t reflect on Mike Sherry. The test was my idea, his contribution was to set the zones. So if you’re going to say someone doesn’t understand lactate, that would be me, which I freely admit.

I don’t mean for this to seem argumentative, I’m genuinely interested in what you have to say. I tried to read those studies but they made my head spin. Did they mention the magnitude of drift in lactate?

mike

about lactate…a simple search on pubmed.com will return numerous studies that show repeated bouts of exercise will alter lactate levels in subsequent bouts…
For example: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=17540836&ordinalpos=20&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

This one is particular means it can’t be used to determine “wuss factor” in repeated bouts even 3.5 hrs apart…

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=9662681&ordinalpos=8&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

I know you’re not submitting this for peer review, but this “test” was flawed from the onset…doing it after the speedplay trial on the same day…and tossing in the “red herring” of lactate doesn’t prove anything. That the tester doesn’t know this speaks volumes about his use of lactate data. (period)

Andy

During that period I make a concerted effort to ride the TT bike a lot. I think I did most of my hard rides on the TT bike, so it was something like 3 rides a week. Lubanski says that there should be no adjustment period

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bikesgonewild

…although you rode them for 6 months on your tt bike, i would assume you ride a road bike w/ regular pedals a good bit more…should simple physiological adaptability be considered a factor regarding your power output ?…is there just enough of a difference in extension or range through the 360* that your legs & hips won’t easily accommodate the motion simply due to lack of experience (regular training) in comparison ?…

…i remember seeing the smp’s 3 years ago at the show & immediately thinking that it ‘seemed’ like a sound bio-mechanical concept…you & mr zinn concur on that aspect & also on the fact that the smp’s unwieldy attachment function can be a problem…it stands to reason that bearing load would also be problematic…

…sweet talk vista into a test of their version for the road bike although it’s obvious cornering clearance will be a compromise…
…cheers…

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In doing tests, I often find that I go into them with a pre-conceived bias. I usually root for the product to be good. In my homemade wind tunnel helmet test, I wanted my sponsor’s helmet to win, and had to try very hard to be neutral and accurate when taking measurements. In this case, I think it’s good to have a number (lactate) that I can’t consciously control verify the outcome. I went into this test expecting the SMP’s to win, so I’m sure we would’ve tested and re-tested if I was just relying on perception. I think we would’ve done the test 1 or 2 more times before I trusted my perception.

Andy

Ah. I only reached 8.4 the second time because the interval was cut short. Who knows what number I would’ve reached after 5 minutes? So 10 vs 8.4 is not a conclusive comparison. I find perception so unreliable (even though in this case it correlated), and I think the results would’ve been less persuasive to most people if I merely stated “it was harder on the SMP’s”.

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Mike

Andy,
You’re absolutely right about the hip angle…my error. Regarding the testing, you stated that at 250W you “began to suffer” and 300W “was …torture (and you) failed” after having ridden with the SMP’s. This would have been enough evidence for me that the SMP’s made generating as much power harder and that Speedplays were my choice for power generation…had you performed the same test with the Speedplays again, you would have found a slightly different lactate profile the second time from the first while still finding power easier to come by. Using the lactate measurement to determine wussy-ness is not IMO necessary OR dependable…ie., does the fact you reached “only” 8.4 mmol as opposed to 10 indicative that you tried harder the first time or that the second time you wussed?
Mike

Jay

The no stack height pedal had him lower his saddle. Keeping his bar at the same height would make his hip angle more open not more closed.

Andy

I have to admit I don’t understand the first paragraph. I hadn’t perceived the difference while riding, and I don’t race with a power meter, so I don’t know if my power was down in races. Also, had it not been for the lactate numbers, I might have just thought myself a wuss for not completing the second 300 watt interval. Can you clarify what you meant?

I couldn’t drop my bars any more without getting a adjustable stem, so I just left the bars as is. But my hip angle was more open with the SMP’s.

Mike

Excellent example for illustrating that the RPE correlates very highly with both power output AND lactate measurement (in a relative sense). For me, the takeaway message is the results/conclusions would not change had lactate been omitted. “Field testing” showed that 250W felt harder with the SMP’s and that 300W wasn’t complete-able. Lactate analysis contributed nothing and was meaningless without power to correlate it to.

And a quick question Andy: Did you alter bar positions for the test to maintain “other” angles? (Perhaps the higher power requirements were made more difficult as a result of “closing” the angle at the hip)

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Jay

a somewhat expensive way to lower stack height, but keep q factor with speedplays is to get Rocket 7 shoes with their special speedplay drilling. Between their thinner carbon sole and the lack of the speedplay adaptor plate that you no longer need, you get a significantly lower stack height. I have used this for over a year and like the set up.

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